House report rips Bush’s ‘unsubstantiated’ use of signing statements - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-21-2008, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Zeitgeist View Post
Yeah, the subject of the thread is a criticism of the Shrub Administration, which hasn't been one of your strong suits
Why make it unnecessarily difficult for someone to express an honest opinion, especially when you agree with them? In this case I think Bot is correct - there is a Constitutional question that should be resolved in the courts. But maybe after Shrub is gone and the court has been balanced....

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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-21-2008, 07:34 PM Thread Starter
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Signing statements may, if used appropriately, serve a legitimate function as a tool for continuing dialogue between the President, Congress, and the public. On the other hand, signing statements may be a mechanism to expand executive authority at the expense of the legislature.
Halstead maintains that the presidential act of issuing a signing statement is generally not, in and of itself, problematic from a legal or institutional standpoint. According to Rosenkranz, the President may use such statements to express his interpretation of a law, and to direct the Administration on how to execute the law. This informs the public and Congress of the President’s interpretation of legislation, and gives Congress the opportunity, if it disagrees with the President’s construction of a statute, to pass clarifying legislation.
However, the broad and unsubstantiated objections raised in the FY08 NDAA signing statement do not contain, Halstead says, “explicit, measurable refusals to enforce a law,” but instead “appear simply to be hortatory assertions of executive power.” As Gary Kepplinger, the General Counsel of the Government Accountability Office, pointed out during the O&I subcommittee hearing, “[T]his orchestrated use of signing statements to raise abstract, conjectural constitutional issues is more to . . . advance an ideology than it is to deal with any particular issues of the moment.” Some believe that the real import of signing statements by the Bush Administration is “part of a comprehensive strategy to strengthen and expand executive authority generally,” by using vague language to assert.
Signing statements should be eliminated, period. As clearly summarized in the above paragraph, the potential for abuse wildly outweighs any potential positive.

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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-21-2008, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar View Post
Signing statements should be eliminated, period.....

The biggest problems we are facing right now have to do with George Bush trying to bring more and more power into the executive branch and not go through Congress at all and thats what I intend to reverse.

~ Senator Barack H. Obama
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-21-2008, 07:44 PM
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From {wiki-signing-statements}:
[edit]Congressional efforts to restrict signing statements

Sen. Arlen Specter (R-Pa.) introduced the Presidential Signing Statements Act of 2006 on July 26, 2006.[18] The bill would:
Instruct all state and federal courts to ignore presidential signing statements. ("No State or Federal court shall rely on or defer to a presidential signing statement as a source of authority.")
Instruct the Supreme Court to allow the U.S. Senate or U.S. House of Representatives to file suit in order to determine the constitutionality of signing statements.[19]
The bill was referred to the Senate Judiciary Committee, which Specter formerly chaired, on the day it was introduced.[20] As with all unpassed bills, it expired with the end of the 109th United States Congress on 9 December 2006.
Specter reintroduced the legislation with the Presidential Signing Statements Act of 2007.[21]

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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-21-2008, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by JimSmith View Post
Why make it unnecessarily difficult for someone to express an honest opinion, especially when you agree with them? In this case I think Bot is correct - there is a Constitutional question that should be resolved in the courts. But maybe after Shrub is gone and the court has been balanced....

'Cause the dude has been carrying and re-carrying water for the administration for the better part of the last five years with nary a shred of criticism. I don't need his or anyone else's opinion to support my own. Toadies get called out, no matter their apparent last minute change of heart
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post #16 of 16 (permalink) Old 08-21-2008, 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Botnst View Post
Read what I wrote.

I didn't like signing statements under previous presidents. Don't like'm under this one.

Can I possibly make it more clear?

I did read what you said regarding your opinion of the signing statments, which I agree with completely. If you peak at the quote that I commented on, however you will see it was regarding your comment on the subject line which is somewhat incongruous to your comments above.

To be more clear. You responded to a different subject very clearly.


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