Dow back up above 11,000 - Page 8 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #71 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-21-2008, 04:14 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Jayhawk's Avatar
 
Date registered: Aug 2005
Vehicle: S500/W220/2000
Location: Lawrence, KS (USA)
Posts: 21,652
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
We WILL come through this stronger. That will happen. But to look at what Bush said through a slightly different perspective...

The unemployment rate is continuing to grow and with 100M more Americans in just the past 40 YEARS making historical standards moot as today's 5.5% equates to 5.5Million more unemployed people than the 5.5% of 1968 and that number doesn't even count those who are not actively collecting unemployment benefits.

Growth is slower that we would like but it is growth nonetheless, except it is not keeping up with inflation so it really is not growth. Consumers are spending, and most of that spending is with credit cards, contributing to the debtor society which cannot be balanced with home equity any longer. Exports have increased, but only at the expense of the US Dollar and the higher cost of Imports and a higher trade deficit.

And finally Productivity is up. That is a good thing until you consider it calculates how much production is gained per worker and that robotics, offshoring and "overtimed" salaried employees contribute to that number. Great for stock market. Blows for the actual economy.

It's all a matter of perspective. Real balance is VERY important and that is what is missing in this economic climate.
Well that is certainaly the view from the Dark Side--as usual!

Don't believe everything you think
Jayhawk is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #72 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-21-2008, 04:34 PM Thread Starter
Will Moderate For Cigars
 
cmitch's Avatar
 
Date registered: Apr 2005
Vehicle: 2002 ML320, 2005 S430 4MATIC, 2010 F150 Crew Cab
Location: City on the TN River
Posts: 10,691
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Quoted: 204 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
(Thread Starter)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
We WILL come through this stronger. That will happen. But to look at what Bush said through a slightly different perspective...

The unemployment rate is continuing to grow and with 100M more Americans in just the past 40 YEARS making historical standards moot as today's 5.5% equates to 5.5Million more unemployed people than the 5.5% of 1968 and that number doesn't even count those who are not actively collecting unemployment benefits.

Growth is slower that we would like but it is growth nonetheless, except it is not keeping up with inflation so it really is not growth. Consumers are spending, and most of that spending is with credit cards, contributing to the debtor society which cannot be balanced with home equity any longer. Exports have increased, but only at the expense of the US Dollar and the higher cost of Imports and a higher trade deficit.

And finally Productivity is up. That is a good thing until you consider it calculates how much production is gained per worker and that robotics, offshoring and "overtimed" salaried employees contribute to that number. Great for stock market. Blows for the actual economy.

It's all a matter of perspective. Real balance is VERY important and that is what is missing in this economic climate.
5.5 million out of 100 million workers. I betcha that you know more losers than 6 in a pool of 100 people. You won't see me getting stitched about unemployment until the rate reaches 7 or 8%. Then, maybe, I could hire some better quality people, instead of these no driver license DUI fools that are behind on child support to 3 different mothers we've been getting applying for work.

2005 S430 4Matic 'Morton' W220.183 • 722.671 Rest in Peace

Bells and whistles are thorns and thistles.
cmitch is offline  
post #73 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-21-2008, 04:54 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Date registered: Mar 2006
Vehicle: 1999 ML320
Location: Ratville
Posts: 24,029
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Quoted: 310 Post(s)
Oh I forget to add. The illegally employed is another not so small percentage.
mlfun is offline  
post #74 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-21-2008, 07:08 PM
~BANNED~
 
Jakarta Expat's Avatar
 
Date registered: Aug 2006
Vehicle: PM me to Join the Expat Muslims for Obama Club........
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia
Posts: 17,697
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
I can't find any fundamentals that suggest the market has bottomed. I spent at least 20 hours this past week researching and calculating and nothing came up.

I don't see where Paulson gets his "our economy has got very strong long-term fundamentals, solid fundamentals." It would be nice for him to actually list them or point out which fundamentals would be considered, by any measuring "strong".


If Paulson said it, it must be true, of course I bet he has revised his CV and is starting to pass it out. Anyone who can make statements like that and they are automatically true, he will be heavily in demand............
Jakarta Expat is offline  
post #75 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-21-2008, 10:23 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
mcbear's Avatar
 
Date registered: Apr 2004
Vehicle: E500Es
Location: The BlueGrass State
Posts: 29,579
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmitch View Post
5.5 million out of 100 million workers. I betcha that you know more losers than 6 in a pool of 100 people. You won't see me getting stitched about unemployment until the rate reaches 7 or 8%. Then, maybe, I could hire some better quality people, instead of these no driver license DUI fools that are behind on child support to 3 different mothers we've been getting applying for work.
Read what I wrote, that is 5.5 MILLION addition unemployed people for an additional 100Million population in the past 40 years which moots the "historic" comments Bush made.

In other words, 5.5% of 200M and 5.5% of 300M population are not similar numbers of people out of work. And the numbers don't count those who are NOT ACTIVELY RECEIVING BENEFITS.

If you are having a hard time hiring workers except the ones you suggest, maybe you need to provide a Living Wage. I would bet the quality of workers would improve. I have found that, with only 3 exceptions out of 42 that has been the case.

McBear,
Kentucky

Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
mcbear is offline  
post #76 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-22-2008, 05:27 AM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 95 E300
Location: Inside my head
Posts: 36,850
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 392 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
...

In other words, 5.5% of 200M and 5.5% of 300M population are not similar numbers of people out of work. And the numbers don't count those who are NOT ACTIVELY RECEIVING BENEFITS.
....
Well, you understand the idea of proportionality -- a percent is just that. If the proportion is low, that's a good thing. Would you not agree with me that lower is better?

I doubt you could find a more squishy argument about employment. How many people are they? What are they doing? Is it by choice or not? How do you know?

B

The biggest problems we are facing right now have to do with George Bush trying to bring more and more power into the executive branch and not go through Congress at all and that’s what I intend to reverse.

~ Senator Barack H. Obama

Last edited by Botnst; 07-22-2008 at 05:30 AM.
Botnst is offline  
post #77 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-22-2008, 07:33 AM Thread Starter
Will Moderate For Cigars
 
cmitch's Avatar
 
Date registered: Apr 2005
Vehicle: 2002 ML320, 2005 S430 4MATIC, 2010 F150 Crew Cab
Location: City on the TN River
Posts: 10,691
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Quoted: 204 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
(Thread Starter)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
Read what I wrote, that is 5.5 MILLION addition unemployed people for an additional 100Million population in the past 40 years which moots the "historic" comments Bush made.

In other words, 5.5% of 200M and 5.5% of 300M population are not similar numbers of people out of work. And the numbers don't count those who are NOT ACTIVELY RECEIVING BENEFITS.

If you are having a hard time hiring workers except the ones you suggest, maybe you need to provide a Living Wage. I would bet the quality of workers would improve. I have found that, with only 3 exceptions out of 42 that has been the case.
The thing about percentages, is that they always work. It's a proportionate number of the population. Sure, there are 5.5 million MORE but there is also 100 million more consumers. It levels out.

And, since WHEN should an employer offer a 'Living Wage' on entry level, to an unexperienced worker fresh out of high school? Are you now advocating the 'entitlement' philosophy? What happened to EARNING your way to the top, like I and most of my other co-workers did? You cannot be honestly suggesting that entry level jobs be offered 'Living Wage'?

2005 S430 4Matic 'Morton' W220.183 • 722.671 Rest in Peace

Bells and whistles are thorns and thistles.
cmitch is offline  
post #78 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-22-2008, 09:06 AM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Jayhawk's Avatar
 
Date registered: Aug 2005
Vehicle: S500/W220/2000
Location: Lawrence, KS (USA)
Posts: 21,652
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmitch View Post
The thing about percentages, is that they always work. It's a proportionate number of the population. Sure, there are 5.5 million MORE but there is also 100 million more consumers. It levels out.

And, since WHEN should an employer offer a 'Living Wage' on entry level, to an unexperienced worker fresh out of high school? Are you now advocating the 'entitlement' philosophy? What happened to EARNING your way to the top, like I and most of my other co-workers did? You cannot be honestly suggesting that entry level jobs be offered 'Living Wage'?
That is especially true when one considers the high cost of training for those often lazy and semi-literate high school graduates and drop-outs. This "living wage" bullshit just hurts the very people it purports to help. Crazy PC-types really need to re-examine their strategy...

Don't believe everything you think
Jayhawk is offline  
post #79 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-22-2008, 01:15 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
mcbear's Avatar
 
Date registered: Apr 2004
Vehicle: E500Es
Location: The BlueGrass State
Posts: 29,579
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmitch View Post
And, since WHEN should an employer offer a 'Living Wage' on entry level, to an unexperienced worker fresh out of high school? Are you now advocating the 'entitlement' philosophy? What happened to EARNING your way to the top, like I and most of my other co-workers did? You cannot be honestly suggesting that entry level jobs be offered 'Living Wage'?
I am advocating a BUSINESS PHILOSOPHY. You get what you pay for. Simple as that. You offer only minimum wage, you only get a certain group of people. You offer a Living Wage and your workforce changes. That has been proven time and again. You simply get what you pay for, whether you are buying tools, cars, computers, hotel rooms or employees.

Oh, and a living wage is NOT "the top". Everyone still needs to EARN their way there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayhawk View Post
That is especially true when one considers the high cost of training for those often lazy and semi-literate high school graduates and drop-outs. This "living wage" bullshit just hurts the very people it purports to help. Crazy PC-types really need to re-examine their strategy...
Treat folks poorly and pay them "just getting by" money and they give you "just getting by" work. That is an unfortunate fact of life. Treat people with respect and you find much better results.

McBear,
Kentucky

Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
mcbear is offline  
post #80 of 118 (permalink) Old 07-22-2008, 01:22 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Date registered: Mar 2006
Vehicle: 1999 ML320
Location: Ratville
Posts: 24,029
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Quoted: 310 Post(s)
Why the pervasive use of illegal workforce then ? Presumably, these workers are not
paid "living" wages otherwise they won't be living 10 persons in one apartment.
mlfun is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Mercedes-Benz Forum > General Mercedes-Benz Forums > Off-Topic

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Mercedes-Benz Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











  • Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
     
    Thread Tools
    Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
    Email this Page Email this Page
    Display Modes
    Linear Mode Linear Mode



    Similar Threads
    Topic Author Forum Replies Last Post
    DOW drops below 11,000 FeelTheLove Off-Topic 6 07-15-2008 11:45 AM
    Dow Theory: Is the Bull back? Jayhawk Off-Topic 44 04-25-2008 07:38 PM
    Back from my 5,000 mile venture out East! ALephart R170 SLK-Class 4 10-09-2007 12:16 PM
    G500 factory Buy Back after 40,000+ miles smalk G-Class 5 10-10-2005 11:16 PM
    Oil hits 61 a barrell, DOW heads back to 9,000, jobs report shows massive cuts, so what else is new FeelTheLove Off-Topic 8 07-09-2005 10:47 AM

    Posting Rules  
    You may post new threads
    You may post replies
    You may not post attachments
    You may not edit your posts

    BB code is On
    Smilies are On
    [IMG] code is On
    HTML code is Off
    Trackbacks are On
    Pingbacks are On
    Refbacks are On

     

    Title goes here

    close
    video goes here
    description goes here. Read Full Story
    For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome