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post #41 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-18-2008, 05:05 PM
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It is up to the people to decide what they want to do with the information. I'm disappointed that they don't share my peculiar views, but that's the nature of representative democracy. I wont be ecstatic under a Clinton, McCain or Obama presidency but even in the worst case, it is still far, far better than the alternative. The republic will survive and there will be another election and we will have a different posse of clowns to endure.

B

The biggest problems we are facing right now have to do with George Bush trying to bring more and more power into the executive branch and not go through Congress at all and that’s what I intend to reverse.

~ Senator Barack H. Obama
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post #42 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-18-2008, 08:40 PM
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Frankly, I don't give a damned what other people do. What I do care about is that people have a free choice of whether or not to make the choice. I am deeply offended by the elitist notion that some people are better or smarter or educated such that they are peculiarly suited to make decisions for other folks. Fuck that. Let each person decide for himself what is appropriate for himself -- whether through elections or the market or the remote control. It's about freedom and self-determination.

B
You totally miss the point of the thread. The point is that mass media has moved Real News off the front burners for the majority of consumers and replaced it with Hollywood and Sports and American Idol updates and Car Chases. That leaves the vast majority of people with minimal options for gleaning the Real News without having to go to inordinate changes in habit. [Not everyone wants to or likes surfing the net and digging through web sites to find real news].

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Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
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post #43 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-18-2008, 08:47 PM
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Quite the contrary. The media has lost control of the news, and that is the best possible thing that can happen, after the government losing control of the news, post Korean War.

You have more opportunity to learn more about current events worldwide at this time than at any time in human history. This is the first time in history that neither the media nor government controls the information flow.

B
How do you balance that with Arbitron and Neilson numbers that say that 84.5% of Americans still get their news from the SAME SEVEN PROVIDERS.

While you say they have the opportunity, you assume they have the skill, time, resources, patience and desire to spend over the 30 or so minutes that most people spend watching NEWS. And because NEWS broadcasters are fighting for ratings with 600 non news cable channels, internet porn, forums, Entertainment Tonight and Nancy Grace, they have segmented their broadcasts to try and micro-program non-news to entice an ADD target market. The result is LESS REAL NEWS and a LESS INFORMED PUBLIC.

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post #44 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-18-2008, 09:24 PM
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You totally miss the point of the thread. The point is that mass media has moved Real News off the front burners for the majority of consumers and replaced it with Hollywood and Sports and American Idol updates and Car Chases. That leaves the vast majority of people with minimal options for gleaning the Real News without having to go to inordinate changes in habit. [Not everyone wants to or likes surfing the net and digging through web sites to find real news].
I totally got the intent of the thread and totally rejected both the intent and the derivative arguments.

The "vast majority" of people have every opportunity to avail themselves of the same news sources of which I advantage myself. It is up to them to choose whether they wish to or not. That's what we call, "freedom".

I completely reject the notion that some elitist prig should decide whether or not the people are getting proper news. Let the people decide for themselves what they want.

B

The biggest problems we are facing right now have to do with George Bush trying to bring more and more power into the executive branch and not go through Congress at all and that’s what I intend to reverse.

~ Senator Barack H. Obama
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post #45 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-18-2008, 10:42 PM
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you get the media you deserve
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post #46 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-19-2008, 09:50 PM
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I totally got the intent of the thread and totally rejected both the intent and the derivative arguments.

The "vast majority" of people have every opportunity to avail themselves of the same news sources of which I advantage myself. It is up to them to choose whether they wish to or not. That's what we call, "freedom".

I completely reject the notion that some elitist prig should decide whether or not the people are getting proper news. Let the people decide for themselves what they want.

B
If you are happy with an under-informed public who has to go out of their way to get news just because the big 7 is now competing with ET to grab ratings dollars so be it.

But you obviously don't get the point of the posts. The point is that MEDIA focuses on frivolity over substance and the public pays the price with lack of hard information and the dumbing down of this country. Has nothing to do with elitists on either the Supply or Demand side of the equation.

You "assume" folks have "every opportunity to avail themselves". MOST folks work long hours, have families and don't have extra time for hunting down meaty news. MOST folks tune in/ read 30 or so minutes daily because that is all the time they have for it. That does not leave "every opportunity".

There are only so many folks who, like you or I who dig through 15-20 news sources daily, either through curiosity, work or free time - it is not a big number.

McBear,
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post #47 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-19-2008, 10:19 PM
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In defense of the debate, I liked the fact that Obama said that he WOULDN'T raise taxes on anyone making less than $200,00, then turned around and said he'd raise capital gains taxes up to 25% and take the salary lid off social security (currently at $97K). Is he an idiot or what? He's so much like a Clinton.

Charter member of the Vast Rightwing Conspiracy and proud of it.

God Bless the America we're trying to create.
--Hillary Rodham Clinton
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post #48 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-19-2008, 10:24 PM
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I totally got the intent of the thread and totally rejected both the intent and the derivative arguments.

The "vast majority" of people have every opportunity to avail themselves of the same news sources of which I advantage myself. It is up to them to choose whether they wish to or not. That's what we call, "freedom".

I completely reject the notion that some elitist prig should decide whether or not the people are getting proper news. Let the people decide for themselves what they want.

B

Fuckin' A
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post #49 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-21-2008, 03:41 PM Thread Starter
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Hope springs eternal.

Alter: Adios, Sound Bites | Newsweek Voices - Jonathan Alter | Newsweek.com
Adios, Sound Bites & Fat Cats

Sure, the ABC News anchors were out of line to eat up nearly half the debate with their snarky questions on flaps and gaffes, but Barack Obama last week looked like he'd been clocked by the kitchen sink. In his worst debate performance to date, he was low-energy, dodgy and humorless. And yet for all the scratches and dings he's suffered over his incendiary pastor, his "bitter" aspersions and even his patriotism, Obama's Teflon is still working. He's still on track to the Democratic nomination. Part of the explanation is him; it's always harder to trash the smart, cool guy. But a less-recognized reason is the Internet and the Obama campaign's savvy understanding of it. The media and fund-raising rules have undergone a huge change this year. The era of sound bites and fat cats may be coming to a close.

It took me a while to grasp this. On the morning of March 18, when I read an advance text of Obama's Philadelphia speech on race, I told my wife that it was well written but contained no eight- to 15-second sound bites to counteract the Rev. Jeremiah Wright Jr.'s greatest hits. Under the old rules, a 37-minute speech full of complex ideas didn't stand a chance against the excitement of "good TV." Of course, I was wrong. Obama's speech has now been played on YouTube nearly 5.5 million times, with viewers presumably watching at least a few minutes of it.

It turns out the Obama campaign planned it that way. I learned recently that as chief strategist David Axelrod, communications director Robert Gibbs, speechwriter Jon Favreau and Obama himself finalized the speech, they took great care to make sure that no sound bites were included. In other words, they intentionally avoided any of the snappy lines that they know reporters and TV producers are trained to recognize as useful for representing the entire story. A few lines, like the one about Obama's grandmother, did get disproportionately quoted and aired. But the speech was constructed so that you simply couldn't understand it in 10 seconds. If this was making a virtue of necessity—Obama often lacks crispness even when he's speaking well—the speech nonetheless represented a turning point.

It's not that sound bites, which date back at least to Lincoln's "a house divided against itself cannot stand," are dead. In fact, the good, colorful ones get much more play now than in the pre-YouTube age. Obama's words about "bitter" working-class voters who "cling" to religion and guns would have received even greater attention if video had surfaced of him saying them at a closed-door San Francisco fund-raiser. (The poor-quality audio lessened the impact.) All of the candidates still work to fashion memorable expressions to imprint their views—and network news programs still attract large numbers of viewers with their "packages" of sound bites.

But the ecosystem of political media has changed, with sound bites losing their authority. Consumers of news are less easily manipulated by the 24/7 barrage of bites and images (Hillary Clinton doing whisky shots, Obama bowling), which are dissected endlessly on cable. Voters search for their own context. The bad news is that they are often simply looking for their opinions to be validated. The good news is that the search engages them more actively in the process and makes them demand more information than is contained in sound bites.

In knowing the meaning of that term, which was once the inside lingo of TV producers, these voters deconstruct the concept and come to see sound bites as disreputable partisan weapons instead of merely the building blocks of TV pieces. Canned one-liners fall much flatter than they once did. (Remember Hillary's lame "you can't Xerox change" bit?) And with political news more perishable, even the most vivid bits of tape quickly degrade in importance. That's why all the hand-wringing about how much damage the Reverend Wright and San Francisco clips would do to Obama in the fall is exaggerated. The stories will resonate, but at a much lower volume. Attack ads based on them won't get much traction. There's nothing staler than a six-month-old sound bite, even if you can always find it on YouTube.

Just as the Internet has changed television, it's now transforming campaign finance. That sucking sound you hear is the power seeping out of the old, big-money establishment. Last month, a group of heavy-hitting "Hillraisers" (major Clinton donors) sent House Speaker Nancy Pelosi a tart letter threatening to cut off money for the party if Pelosi didn't stop showing deference to the pledged-delegate count, which favors Obama. Those who didn't find the letter annoying just laughed at it.

Why? Because when you have a candidate for president like Obama, who boasts more than 1.3 million donors with an average contribution of only about $100, the fat cats start looking awfully thin. Hillary has also moved away from big donors; the 200,000 small ones she attracted online in February saved her campaign. Consider the magnitude of the change: in 2004, President Bush and Sen. John Kerry raised about 30 percent of their war chests in amounts of $200 or less. By contrast, about 90 percent of Obama's contributors are small fry.

Campaign "bundlers" of individual $2,300 contributions remain important—that's why Obama was in San Francisco for that fund-raiser—but they no longer control the party at the presidential level. (Senate and House races remain in the grip of big donors.) Obama has dramatically extended Howard Dean's 2004 efforts and turned the Web into a source of renewable energy. Even if you dislike Obama, this is a tremendously positive development in American politics.

If he makes it to the White House, Barack Obama will have a hard time changing how Washington works. We know what can happen when an irresistible force meets an immovable object. And his evident irritation at some of the perversities of the game won't help. But even if Obama fades, he and the Web have already transformed that process.
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post #50 of 57 (permalink) Old 04-21-2008, 04:24 PM
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People are waking up. That's what's happening here.. It's about time. Unfortunately, too little, too late...
Whoa, what brings you here Sal?. Getting a Benz?
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