Dow Jumps More Than 400 Points! - Page 8 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #71 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Jayhawk View Post
I know! Thanks for the warning!! His spamming has increased substantially. I'll keep my head down when his shit hits the fan... Brace yourself!
Like you haven't been doing some of that yourself? Did your Mom ever taught you not to throw rock if you live in a glass house?

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/off-...hollywood.html

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/off-...l-bridges.html

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/off-...bama-wins.html

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/off-...u-because.html

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/off-...ide-dubai.html

And need I go on?

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post #72 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 10:40 PM
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The only reason Jaydipshit4brain continues his rant because he wants you to think he is a step above the average Joe American. He wants people to believe he knows his shit, but we all know the truth. OK, there are few exceptions like Bottomfeeder, who happens to willingly to be his bitch.

Not only he does not want to admit the economy has been tanking for over a year now, Jaydipshit4brain never admits Shrub sells out of America is also partially responsible to the shit shape that we are in. When the Chinese comes knocking our doors for the callable debts, who is Shrub gonna call?

Shrub knows full well that he'll have long since retired to his ranch. True, he'll be universally reviled by then--even more than now--but "external reality" never bothered him before, and it won't bother him then. It's gonna bother us.
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post #73 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-13-2008, 10:49 PM
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Remember what Lincoln said:

"Congressmen who willfully take actions during wartime that damage morale and undermine the military are saboteurs and should be arrested, exiled or hanged!!!"

That, I would imagine includes the POTUS too.

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post #74 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 12:06 PM
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Here's some more you forgot from the 1993 tax act by Bill Clinton considered by many to be among the top three tax hikes in the 20th century:

The Clinton Tax Hike

In 1993, President Clinton ushered through Congress a large package of tax increases, which included the following:

An increase in the individual income tax rate to 36 percent and a 10 percent surcharge for the highest earners, thereby effectively creating a top rate of 39.6 percent.

Repeal of the income cap on Medicare taxes. This provision made the 2.9 percent Medicare payroll tax apply to all wage income. Like the Social Security payroll tax base today, the Medicare tax base was capped at a certain level of wage income prior to 1993.

A 4.3 cent per gallon increase in transportation fuel taxes.

An increase in the taxable portion of Social Security benefits (already noted)

A permanent extension of the phase-out of personal exemptions and the phase-down of the deduction for itemized expenses.

Raising the corporate income tax rate to 35 percent.
Dang, you took that bait entirely too quickly.

Now, let's look at this again. I will go slow. Now, when you go to Hawaii, do you go, "that is a lovely looking beach" or do you go "look at those five grains of sand"? I ask that because of the way you listed your "examples" of the 1993 Clinton tax plan. You plucked several little examples where taxes rates went up but failed to look at [or didn't want to acknowledge] the aggregate when making your case.

See, when we pay our federal taxes, they are based on the aggregate of ALL the tax laws, all those little lines in the tax codes, not simply three or four examples.

Are you still with me?

Now, the easiest way to look at the aggregate would be to look at the tax tables for different incomes for 1992 and 1993. That would provide real IRS generated numbers for how much a person pays based on "before" and "after" the mean ol' Clinton Tax plan.

Here are a couple of examples. The columns [which I hate in BW] are Income Level, 1992 Taxes, 1993 Taxes, Difference. I chose the perfect little NeoCon Nucular Family - Married, filing Jointly.

Income Level /1992 Taxes /1993 Taxes /Difference
$36,000 /$5,433 /$5,404 /$ 29 Less
$56,000 /$11,033 /$10,890 /$143 Less
$66,000 /$13,833 /$13,690 /$143 Less
$86,000 /$19,433 /$19,290 /$143 Less
$99,950 /$23,743 /$23,521 /$222 Less
$120,000 /$29,951 /$29,729 /$222 Less
$140,000 /$36,151 /$35,929 /$222 Less

Now, you can wander over to the IRS web site and check these numbers out, I took these from my hard copies.

You also forgot to mention that the tax changes included Increased exemptions and increased standard deductions for everyone.

In 1993 the Family median income was $31,241. Only 9.3% of households saw a potential increase in their taxes [and these are the folks that hire accountants to insure they pay less].

The only tax that everyone paid was the 4.3 cent gas tax. I think that averaged under $40 annually per family if my little calculator is correct.

Enjoy the beach.

McBear,
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Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
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post #75 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 12:52 PM
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Quote: Dow Jumps More Than 400 Points!

And what a dive it took today.
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post #76 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 01:12 PM Thread Starter
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Quote: Dow Jumps More Than 400 Points!

And what a dive it took today.
Both statements are correct. What is your point?

Don't believe everything you think
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post #77 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
Would that be similar to the four years after Clinton pulled the country out of the Reagan/Bush recession, balanced the budget, gathered a surplus, did NOT raise taxes and started the greatest expansion of the US economy in US Economic history? [Dow 3,241 on 1/21/93 --- 11,723 1/14/2000]

He did have a Republican Congress along for the ride but he used the veto pen to keep Republican charge and spending to a minimum [he vetoed 37 times and was overridden only twice]
I recalled your original statement (to document what I objected to) so you won't be tempted to wiggle out of what you asserted (in bold). That was a flat statement that was flatly untrue; the worst type of revisionist history.

Below is the analysis projected for OBRA 93 from the webpage of the Congressioal Budget Office which shows the expected revenue increase in the amount of $241 billion, give or take. Remember, this was such an unpopular Act that Republicans took over the House in 1994 for the first time in about 40 years and the next major tax act in 1997 was entitled, "The Tax Relief Act of 1997."

You are not entitled to your own facts. And, that, my friend McBare, is how the beach looks from here.



"The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1993 (OBRA-93) relies on tax increases for much of its reduction in the deficit. The Congressional Budget Office estimates that OBRA-93 will reduce the deficit by $433 billion between 1994 and 1998. Of this amount, $241 billion (56 percent) will come from increased tax revenues, $77 billion (18 percent) from cuts in mandatory spending, $69 billion (16 percent) from cuts in discretionary spending, and $47 billion (11 percent) from lower debt-service costs. "

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--Hillary Rodham Clinton
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post #78 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 02:38 PM Thread Starter
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^We don't call him "wiggles" for nothing... He can twist and turn an otherwise simple factual statement into what I think of as "bearisms," and totally unrecognizable from the discussion at hand. It can give one mental whiplash, if you're not careful. You can't "win" w/ ol' bear so you might as well stop trying.

Don't believe everything you think
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post #79 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 02:54 PM
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Jayhawk: I'm having too much fun to quit now. Telling the truth carries a lot of impact and most liberals can't take the truth about themselves. They are best at seeing what they believe; I like it the other way around.

E.g. in today's RMN, there was an article about a school principal who had decided to pay kids for showing up for their "NCLB" tests. His quote was priceless: "I don't believe in it, but it works." Well, duh.

There may be some hope for McBare after the burglary. You know the old saying, "A liberal is just a conservative who hasn't been mugged yet." One of those underpaid teachers failed to teach those scumbags that they only had to form a union and they could have stolen McBare blind and legally.

Charter member of the Vast Rightwing Conspiracy and proud of it.

God Bless the America we're trying to create.
--Hillary Rodham Clinton

Last edited by bottomline1; 03-14-2008 at 03:04 PM.
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post #80 of 437 (permalink) Old 03-14-2008, 03:01 PM Thread Starter
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The dive cancels out a large part of the jump, the premise of this thread.
"...premise?" There is no premise to my first post--just a simple statement of fact, an observation of something. Just read my first post.

A premise presumes an argument of some type. I was not arguing for or against anything. Just observing a near-record Dow close for that day. Here's what Wiki says:

In discourse and logic, a premise (also "premiss" in British usage) is a claim that is a reason (or element of a set of reasons) for, or objection against, some other claim. In other words, it is a statement presumed true within the context of an argument toward a conclusion.

Don't believe everything you think
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