Ron Paul...is he finished? - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #11 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 02:59 PM
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These were separate events - the first, over $4 million in a day, followed a month or so later by a $6 million day.
Paul sets one-day GOP fundraising record - Ron Paul - MSNBC.com
Ron Paul Supporters Make History with $6 Million Online Haul -- Updated | Threat Level from Wired.com

And on the 4Q fundraising item: Ron Paul's $20 Million 4th Quarter Rivals Hillary - Politics on The Huffington Post
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post #12 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 04:11 PM
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Who is Ron Paul..............
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post #13 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 04:27 PM
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Populist, grass-roots type candidates don't have a snowball's chance in hell of ever being elected to an office as important as the presidency as long as election chances are measured in campaign donations. No matter how popular a candidate is with the people in the street, they will never be able to raise as much money as the establishment candidates that have the support of rich and powerful corporations and interests. These are the types of interests that have the power to shut a candidate's message out of the media and keep them out of debates. The established political order will always work to propagate itself. It will never change the rules to allow someone like Ron Paul to have a chance. It will forever be "democracy lite", with nothing more than the choice between two candidates that have both been vetted and accepted by the prevailing political and corporate orders. Check out the new boss, same as the old boss.

Figure out a way to keep corporate money out of the elections, and that would be a good step in the right direction. Have a legitimate and organized third party alternative, and you've moving further in the right direction. Until that, someone like Ron Paul will never be anything more than a congressman who says a lot of common sense things that resonate with common people.
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post #14 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by jlomon View Post
Populist, grass-roots type candidates don't have a snowball's chance in hell of ever being elected to an office as important as the presidency as long as election chances are measured in campaign donations. No matter how popular a candidate is with the people in the street, they will never be able to raise as much money as the establishment candidates that have the support of rich and powerful corporations and interests. These are the types of interests that have the power to shut a candidate's message out of the media and keep them out of debates. The established political order will always work to propagate itself. It will never change the rules to allow someone like Ron Paul to have a chance. It will forever be "democracy lite", with nothing more than the choice between two candidates that have both been vetted and accepted by the prevailing political and corporate orders. Check out the new boss, same as the old boss.

Figure out a way to keep corporate money out of the elections, and that would be a good step in the right direction. Have a legitimate and organized third party alternative, and you've moving further in the right direction. Until that, someone like Ron Paul will never be anything more than a congressman who says a lot of common sense things that resonate with common people.
It is the responsibility of the people to decide who they wish to vote for. Lots of folks have tried to "buy" elections but it is not successful unless they also have the ability to lead. Take Ross Perot, for example.

He had a good shot at a 3rd party run because he had a message AND he was willing to spend his own (considerable) wealth. Many people liked his outside-populist message combined with a deep patriotic belief in this country. But he failed because he could not delegate and he could not take advice from his friends and supporters and couldn't take criticism of any sort from anybody. As pressure grew he became erratic and drifty. Even so, there was enough discontent with the major candidates that he did rather well.

It looked like he was going to make a serious run the second time until he came-up with a very strange conspiracy theory involving GHW Bush and sabotaging his daughter's wedding. Lots of people were thinking about that kind of guy sitting near the Big Red Button.


In the final analysis, it is less about money than it is about organizational skills and leadership. Say what we might about the current crop but the winners so far have won by using considerable skills of leadership and organization. They take advice from friends let criticism roll off or deflect it back to the critic pretty effectively. People want a steady hand and effective leader and manager. They also want a vision or goal that offers them a personal buy-in.

Ron Paul just couldn't reach that level. He has a very clear vision and a lot of people (me included) buy-in to a big portion of it. The message was not his problem: It was in execution. He does not display leadership qualities either in his own organization or on TV. He was doomed. I hope somebody with those qualities takes-up his vision in future elections. IMO it will have to be bottom-up -- win the school board race on those principles. Win the sheriff race on those principles. Etc.

The biggest problems we are facing right now have to do with George Bush trying to bring more and more power into the executive branch and not go through Congress at all and thatís what I intend to reverse.

~ Senator Barack H. Obama
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post #15 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 05:39 PM
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This is kind of interesting...received it in e-mail from the campaign today.
We received this message this morning from a Ron Paul supporter in Florida. Because it is so important, we are sharing it with you, too.

I wanted to share my experience canvassing here in Broward County, South Florida.

As you know, Dr. Paul took 3% of the vote yesterday in Florida. A friend and I signed up on the campaign's website to be a precinct leader, and took it upon ourselves to canvass 13 precincts in Broward County. I'm proud to report that in the precincts that we canvassed, Dr. Paul came in second to John McCain.

That's right; Dr. Paul beat Romney, Giuliani and Huckabee. This happened with almost NO media coverage of Dr. Paul. It's particularly noteworthy, because Broward County is a stronghold of Rudy Giuliani.

We know of other Dr. Paul supporters in Broward County who were waving Dr. Paul's signs, but they did not do that well in their precincts. Sign waving does NOT get votes, BUT PRECINCT WORK DOES GET VOTES!!! Please do the precinct work in your area so that Dr. Paul will win. God Bless You.
This is a candidate without a campaign.
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post #16 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 05:50 PM
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When I saw the title I was going to say the same thing.
Same here so I'm glad I read a few posts before repeating that opinion. The main thing I like about him is that he is a medical doctor and might have a clue how screwed up the US healthcare system has become. Others are talking about it, but he should have some firsthand experience. Whether, or not, he could have made a positive impact on this important issue is a question that no one can answer.

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post #17 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 07:04 PM
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This is kind of interesting...received it in e-mail from the campaign today.

This is a candidate without a campaign.
BINGO

There HAS to be a full fledged organization, nationwide to get candidates in Congressional Seats, to get precinct workers, ward bosses, arm twisters, drivers, the entire infrastructure. That takes time and money and time and money. That is what Dr. Paul lacked.

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post #18 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 07:15 PM
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The Q4 numbers for Paul vs Hillary might show a pop for Paul BUT, Hillary came into Q4 with $90M and Obama with $80M and both took in about $24M for the quarter. That puts them at $114M and $104M totals by the end of Q4. Paul would be about $28M for the same TOTAL CAMPAIGN time frame

And the real amazing part is that, while Romney and McCain have less than $5M Cash on hand as of last week [and Romney is in Trust money, the kids will appreciate that] while Clinton and Obama both have around $40M in cash reserves not used yet.

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post #19 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 07:18 PM
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The Q4 numbers for Paul vs Hillary might show a pop for Paul BUT, Hillary came into Q4 with $90M and Obama with $80M and both took in about $24M for the quarter. That puts them at $114M and $104M totals by the end of Q4. Paul would be about $28M for the same TOTAL CAMPAIGN time frame

And the real amazing part is that, while Romney and McCain have less than $5M Cash on hand as of last week [and Romney is in Trust money, the kids will appreciate that] while Clinton and Obama both have around $40M in cash reserves not used yet.
Wow, buying candidates is really expensive.

The biggest problems we are facing right now have to do with George Bush trying to bring more and more power into the executive branch and not go through Congress at all and thatís what I intend to reverse.

~ Senator Barack H. Obama
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post #20 of 48 (permalink) Old 01-30-2008, 07:48 PM
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Isn't it funny how we measure a candidate's popularity these days in terms of how much money they garner, but don't pay attention to who is paying the bill?

I never believed that Dr. Paul had a chance, especially after our media essentially ignored him. But, if change is to happen, we should all tell our children about him and other candidates who told the truth as they knew it, didn't coddle to anyone, didn't happen to come across their positions after the latest poll, and wouldn't sell their souls to the establishment in their respective parties. There is no candidate left with those qualifications (presuming that Dr. Paul fades away), but they're out there, every election, it is up to us to elect them.

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