Most of Al-Qaeda network destroyed in Iraq in 2007 - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #11 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-30-2007, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by livefreeordie View Post
IMO i don't think you will ever get rid of AQ, they bread like Roach's you kill one four more show up. At best we can control them but never wipe them out.
AQ is a decentralized terrorist organization that has no HQ, no command structure, no organization. It is a tremendous number of independent cells that each feed off of their own beliefs and hatred. It will never be removed as a threat until the cells simply decide to either take their fundamental ways to a different sandbox or they no longer perceive the US as a agent against their beliefs.

In some respects the very worst thing we can do is kill OBL as he then becomes a martyr for the worldwide cause and we become even more focused as the target. It is a nasty conundrum.

It is why going after them with a military force is the most brain dead strategy imaginable. We are treating them as a nation or a fighting force that can be fought with whiteboard strategies. Fighting a terrorist organization requires a police force. It worked in Europe against Red Brigade and the organizations of the 70s and 80s. Military force did not work.

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post #12 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 05:22 AM
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In some respects the very worst thing we can do is kill OBL as he then becomes a martyr for the worldwide cause and we become even more focused as the target. It is a nasty conundrum.
I propose giving him an early afternoon talk show. At most he'd last a couple of years like Rosie before losing any remnants of popularity and in a best possible case, it could be as fleeting as the Martin Short debacle. Obscurity would soon follow.

Problem solved.

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post #13 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 07:25 AM
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If Osama were obliterated by a JDAM people could reverently behold the martyr on a sponge.

Whether Osama lives or dies is not especially important. It appears that the strategy for dealing with Al Qaeda is mostly bottom-up (otherwise we'd invade Pakistan and to hell with international relations), though no target of opportunity appears to be excluded. That strategy seems to be working as there have been no major Al Qaeda actions in most of the world, indicating that the sphere of influence is shrinking. Also, the spontaneously produced cells in say England and the USA, are now getting broken-up well before they can achieve any overt missions. As a result, the 'soldiers' look like inept misfits -- which is what they are.

What is the difference between an inept misfit and a major event? Ask Lee Harvey Oswald or Sirhan B. Sirhan, etc.

I think the profssionals recognize that OBL is a minor player at this point. He has no way to recruit and train Al Qaeda in the manner he was able to do back when he had operating bases in Africa and Afghanistan. Now he sends a message of blessing to would-be martyrs in lieu of training. Untrained martyrs can do damage. But nothing spectacular without extensive training in planning, surveillance, infiltration, and so forth. That's why the current wave of would-be terrorists seem so laughably inept. They are inept, untrained amateurs. It's all they have left. The trained Al Qaedistas have gloriously martyred themselves in Iraq.

B

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post #14 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 07:48 AM
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If Osama were obliterated by a JDAM people could reverently behold the martyr on a sponge.

Whether Osama lives or dies is not especially important. It appears that the strategy for dealing with Al Qaeda is mostly bottom-up (otherwise we'd invade Pakistan and to hell with international relations), though no target of opportunity appears to be excluded. That strategy seems to be working as there have been no major Al Qaeda actions in most of the world, indicating that the sphere of influence is shrinking. Also, the spontaneously produced cells in say England and the USA, are now getting broken-up well before they can achieve any overt missions. As a result, the 'soldiers' look like inept misfits -- which is what they are.

What is the difference between an inept misfit and a major event? Ask Lee Harvey Oswald or Sirhan B. Sirhan, etc.

I think the profssionals recognize that OBL is a minor player at this point. He has no way to recruit and train Al Qaeda in the manner he was able to do back when he had operating bases in Africa and Afghanistan. Now he sends a message of blessing to would-be martyrs in lieu of training. Untrained martyrs can do damage. But nothing spectacular without extensive training in planning, surveillance, infiltration, and so forth. That's why the current wave of would-be terrorists seem so laughably inept. They are inept, untrained amateurs. It's all they have left. The trained Al Qaedistas have gloriously martyred themselves in Iraq.

B
Who are you and what have you done with McBear?

Dig's edit:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Botnst
The trained Al Qaedistas have gloriously martyred themselves in Iraq.
I hear they're sold out of vestal virgins at the Baghdad Wal*Mart.

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post #15 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 08:58 AM
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The Iraqi interior ministry lauded its achievements over the past year on Saturday, saying that 75 percent of Al-Qaeda's networks in the country had been destroyed in 12 months.

Ministry spokesman Abdul Karim Khalaf also outlined sharp falls in the numbers of assassinations, kidnappings and death squad murders.

Iraq says most of Al-Qaeda network destroyed in 2007

Wow, fire Rumsfled like the Democrats demanded, put in more troops like the generals Rumsfled fired demanded, and what do you know, things get better.

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

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post #16 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 09:46 AM
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Actually he did. The attacks occurred in October of 2000, just 90 days before he left office and by the time he handed the keys to Bush he had basic Intel on who did it, where they were and the levels of responsibility. Let's see what the Bushies had to say:
And what of the previous attacks? The fool in office at the time decided to treat it like a civil offence, a police matter. That served us very well didn’t it. OBL was not a priority for Bill, because he didn’t have a clue. His administration cut any link, and in fact put up walls between the various Intel agencies to prevent cross referencing any Intel.

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Now you have to ask yourself exactly what flies the boy had actually been swatting. Even the BS had not piled that high yet.
At that point all he had to go on was the Intel that was produced by the gutted agencies that were left over from the previous admins., and that wasn't much because they were still not allowed to talk to each other.
It interesting how you like to omit what Clinton did to cut the Intel, and then blame Bush for not being as well informed as you think he should have been......

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post #17 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 12:27 PM
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I propose giving him an early afternoon talk show. At most he'd last a couple of years like Rosie before losing any remnants of popularity and in a best possible case, it could be as fleeting as the Martin Short debacle. Obscurity would soon follow.

Problem solved.
What about a team show with Rosie and Osama? That way you can get both problems into obscurity at the same time.

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post #18 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 12:31 PM
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Dig's edit: I hear they're sold out of vestal virgins at the Baghdad Wal*Mart.
There was a lead issue. They had to be recalled.

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post #19 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 12:41 PM
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And what of the previous attacks? The fool in office at the time decided to treat it like a civil offence, a police matter. That served us very well didn’t it. OBL was not a priority for Bill, because he didn’t have a clue. His administration cut any link, and in fact put up walls between the various Intel agencies to prevent cross referencing any Intel.



At that point all he had to go on was the Intel that was produced by the gutted agencies that were left over from the previous admins., and that wasn't much because they were still not allowed to talk to each other.
It interesting how you like to omit what Clinton did to cut the Intel, and then blame Bush for not being as well informed as you think he should have been......
Actually, my comments were in reference to your mention of the COLE only. So to chide that I didn't discuss other incidences at the same time is a bit disingenuous. I addressed the issues you brought up completely.

And I didn't blame Bush at all for his actions based on the pretty quick intel that he received. [try getting hard intel out of Muslim countries that are not your friends in under 90 days]. I simply asked what "flies he was tired of swatting" regarding AQ considering he had only been in office 60 days and made the decision NOT TO ACT against OBL.

It is somewhat interesting that Bush did have intel against OBL in March 2001 and didn't want to swat flies. I admire you for bringing the Cole retaliation subject up. Most Republicans try to hide that one way under the carpet.

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post #20 of 170 (permalink) Old 12-31-2007, 12:52 PM
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For nearly my entire life, I have been aware that there’s no explaining a large segment of the population. For instance, even as a kid, I found myself wondering why people would choose to drive really ugly cars, and, what’s more, I’m still wondering. We all can’t afford to drive Jaguars or Porsches, but we always have a choice when it comes to whether the car is red or blue or black. So how is it that Detroit would bring out pea green Fords or dismal gray Chevys and know there would be a market for them? It’s not as if they were sold at a discount. I would see people drive these putrid-colored vehicles and wonder if, just possibly, they were all colorblind.

That’s how I’ve come to view people’s presidential preferences. Granted, being a conservative, I favor the GOP. But how can Democratic voters look at Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama, John Edwards and Dennis Kucinich, and not gag? God knows that’s how I feel about Ron Paul. It confounds me that after his gaffe during the first Republican debate, he didn’t simply shrivel up and disappear. The very idea that a U.S. congressman could blame the tragedy of 9/11 on American foreign policy, suggesting that if we only pulled our troops out of Iraq, we’d have peace in our time, displays such blithering idiocy, it makes John Edwards look like a deep thinker.



Producer Oprah Winfrey arrives at the premiere of "The Great Debaters" at the Arclight Cinerama Dome in Hollywood, California December 11, 2007. The movie is based on the true story of Melvin B. Tolson and opens in the U.S. on December 25. REUTERS/Mario Anzuoni (UNITED STATES)
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Long before Desert Storm, someone should remind Rep. Paul, we were having our bases bombed and our citizens taken hostage. And what does he make of Islamic terrorism in Bali, France, the Philippines, Japan, Spain and Russia, not to mention the barbaric response to newspaper cartoons and teddy bears?

If, when Ron Paul fails to win the GOP nomination, he decides to run as a third party candidate, he should not want for campaign funding. Between the Democrats, who’ll want to encourage him to split the Republican vote, and Hezbollah’s looking to spread their anti-Israel bilge, Paul’s coffers should be filled to capacity.

It’s a strange thing about third party candidates that they invariably serve the interests of those whom they allegedly oppose. In ’92 and ’96, Ross Perot did more to help Clinton get elected than Al Gore did. In 2000, it may well have been Ralph Nader’s candidacy, not Florida, that provided George Bush with his actual margin of victory.

At this juncture, though, the wild card in the 2008 election is a woman named Oprah Winfrey. Not being a devotee of afternoon television, I’ve never watched her show. What I know about her, I’ve gleaned over the years from reading tabloid headlines while standing in checkout lines at the supermarket. So, I know she’s a billionaire who has lost and gained and lost about 4,000 pounds over the years, and I also know that she’s had the world’s longest engagement to someone named Stedman.

A while back, though, I read a rather astonishing item in the newspaper. It seems she had declared that the only presidential candidate who would be allowed on her show was the junior -- the very junior -- senator from Illinois. Now I could understand that, being a Democrat, she wouldn’t want to put out the welcome mat for Giuliani, Romney, Huckabee, McCain or Thompson. But why carry water for Obama, but not Hillary Clinton or John Edwards? From my vantage point, I can’t see a scintilla of difference in their politics. They’re all left-wingers, after all, who believe that raising taxes is the solution to all problems.

The only difference I could see was the only difference that I could literally see -- namely, that Barack Obama was darker complexioned than the other two. Was the fact that Obama’s sperm donor, a man who’d deserted his wife and little Barack at just about the time the umbilical cord was cut, sufficient reason for Oprah to give the guy her official blessing?

If a Mormon TV talk show host refused to have any of the candidates on his show other than Mitt Romney or if Larry King banished everyone who wasn’t Jewish from his domain, I’m dead certain he’d face universal condemnation. So how is it that Oprah goes so far as to hit the hustings with Obama and nobody even says “Boo”?
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