NRA on the Side of Terrorists - Page 5 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #41 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-07-2007, 05:58 AM Thread Starter
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Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 2014 E250 Bluetec 4-Matic, 1983 240D 4-Speed
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce R.
I love hearing how the uninitiated talk about closing the (non existant) loopholes. A thief is NOT a loophole, he's a thief. If you can stop a burglary by the wave of your hand Jim, PLEASE do so, the Police would love you for it....

Do you have any clue how ridicules that last comment of yours is? "Eliminate those opportunities." Do you think just maybe people are working on both sides of that problem, it's just like saying eliminate the opportunity to buy or sell drugs….. That's worked real well hasn't it?
I would agree with you if there were a dozen guns stolen every year, or some other very small number. That is not the case, apparently. So, I think if I was the gun manufacturer and wanted to stay in business, I would try something new to keep theft down. And, I am fairly certain the greatest volume of theft occurs outside the manufacturer's plant, and the gun manufacturers know where. It is not worth it under the present arrangement to address that issue effectively. I would propose the gun laws be modified to make it worthwhile to the gun manufacturer to extra care, enough extra care so the guns don't get stolen by the truckload anymore.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce R.
You own a car don't you? Should Mercedes be held responsible for every traffic ticket you get with that car, every accident? I understand that you may not like firearms, but if you're going to try and come up with solutions, at least TRY and make them reasonable and practical.
Like I said earlier, I am not opposed to reasonable weapons being owned by reasonable citizens. I just don't think the present mindset that says this can't be restricted to reasonable categories of weapons is in all of our best interests. MB does not sell machines to the public whose purpose is to cause damage to life and property. And, in some cases automanufacturer's have been held responsibile for damages to life and property caused by customers without the requisite sense and experience to operate the vehicles safely on public roads. They are routinely held responsible when there are damages that can be attributed to a failure of the manufacturer to meet government standards for safety or industry standards for performance. Same with tire manufacturers.

Gun manufacturers should similarly be held responsible for meeting the laws already passed for distributing guns to the public. Only guns have unique uses compared to most consumer products. So they need unique rules and regulations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce R.
Law enforcement and plea bargaining are where lots of problems lie, the judges and prosecutors don't go after the weapons charges. Virginia is starting to do that…. Get caught with a gun, go to jail…. Period. More States should follow that lead.
Now, why is that? But I agree with you, enforce the laws.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce R.
One more thing..... Who do you send to jail when the Fed's have guns stolen from their armories? You might recall there was a TANK stolen in California a few years back, hardly a concealable weapon, yet it caused SEVERE havoc for hours on the back roads and a freeway. What's your answer for that one? Send the chairman of GM to jail?
In that case the manufacturer is likely shielded by his contract with the government from damages beyond the cost of the tank, and from any misuse by the government of the tank. So, in that case the government owns the problem in its entirety. Which they probably stepped up to and paid the victims for damages without making a public spectacle about it.

The right to bear arms should only come with the overt acceptance of responsibility. FTL suggests buying insurance for "what can happen" as a mandatory demonstration of having accepted the responsibility. I can support that approach too, but I think the first thing that has to happen is the laws need to change to establish limits on what "reasonable" weapons for private ownership might be, and then to make the acquisition of such weapons subject to a manufacturing and distribution system that is much more effective at making sure only the intended buyer gets the guns, and that he doesn't resell them outside the "system" and let guns get into the hands of criminals.

Hey, in 1961 the idea of going to the moon by 1970 was really not considered a very likely outcome - the chances of success were so small, the whole NASA project repelled the usual government bureaucrats. But it came out remarkably well. We got there in 1969, after a significant failure on the launch pad. The point is, if law enforcement is not motivated, somehow, to enforce the laws then passing more laws that they can ignore doesn't do much good. Making the manufacturer liable for losses, along with the gun owner, well, that will be enforced by another group of people who are really motivated already. And that will work. Jim
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