Rice to defy US Constitution: will she be impeached? - Page 4 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #31 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Diego97
Get a lucid thought - it has been proven that al-zarkawi (sp?) an AL-Quaeda scout and aid to OBL was in Iraq and so was his followers. Those who hijacked those plane were mere followers of AZI and OBL looking for some virgins... But you know what? we had to find out for sure and you as well as myself have no clue to what is known by our efforts in Gitmo! Gitmo has kept us further safe.
Zarqawi didn't enter Iraq until after we invaded Afghanistan, and Iraq was not complicit in any way in regard to the 9/11 attack. Seriously, you are way out of your league here, you may want to spend a few weeks studying up if you sincerely wish to debate these issues. Many of the folks here have been doing so for years.

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post #32 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 04:40 PM
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Its what i have read and its what i believe! I will never believe that there are, were no terrorist in Iraq before 911 considering there were terrorists in Florida, Arizona, Detroit, Las Vegas, London, Madrid... Only you and your kind who hate this country would like us all to believe that for some reason the terrorists stayed away from Iraq. why oh why would i believe you?
I'm sure there were, just as there were here. And their relationship with the Iraqi government was similar to the relationship of the 9/11 hijackers to ours. So what's the point?

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post #33 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 05:02 PM
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this tactic of 'you dont know what youre talking about so go away until you study more' just isn't going to work. I dont care that most of you old farts spend almost every waking moment on this forum and have for years doesnt make you 'experts' because you are wrong, dead wrong, couldnt be more wrong and what we are discussing is all debateable. So i'm staying, until you fossils see the light. Seems to me the only ones on here that have a clue are jayhawk and botnst and even though i dont always agree with him, mcbear makes a lot of sense. so i'll be here a while and thanks for your concern
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post #34 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 05:41 PM
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Okee-doke -- good luck with that.

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post #35 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar
Okee-doke -- good luck with that.
and i'm to learn from and respect a grown man who says "okee doke"
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post #36 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Diego97
and i'm to learn from and respect a grown man who says "okee doke"
Well shucky darn,argue your case rather than getting baited by Germanstar

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post #37 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 06:32 PM
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Staying out of the argument per se, but just as a point of clarification for all sides, here's some of what the 9/11 Commission detailed in their report:

...
Bin Ladin was also willing to explore possibilities for cooperation with Iraq, even though Iraq's dictator, Saddam Hussein, had never had an Islamist agenda-save for his opportunistic pose as a defender of the faithful against "Crusaders" during the Gulf War of 1991. Moreover, Bin Ladin had in fact been sponsoring anti-Saddam Islamists in Iraqi Kurdistan, and sought to attract them into his Islamic army.53

To protect his own ties with Iraq, Turabi reportedly brokered an agreement that Bin Ladin would stop supporting activities against Saddam. Bin Ladin apparently honored this pledge, at least for a time, although he continued to aid a group of Islamist extremists operating in part of Iraq (Kurdistan) outside of Baghdad's control. In the late 1990s, these extremist groups suffered major defeats by Kurdish forces. In 2001, with Bin Ladin's help they re-formed into an organization called Ansar al Islam. There are indications that by then the Iraqi regime tolerated and may even have helped Ansar al Islam against the common Kurdish enemy.54
...

Though Bin Ladin had promised Taliban leaders that he would be circumspect, he broke this promise almost immediately, giving an inflammatory interview to CNN in March 1997. The Taliban leader Mullah Omar promptly "invited" Bin Ladin to move to Kandahar, ostensibly in the interests of Bin Ladin's own security but more likely to situate him where he might be easier to control.73

There is also evidence that around this time Bin Ladin sent out a number of feelers to the Iraqi regime, offering some cooperation. None are reported to have received a significant response. According to one report, Saddam Hussein's efforts at this time to rebuild relations with the Saudis and other Middle Eastern regimes led him to stay clear of Bin Ladin.74

In mid-1998, the situation reversed; it was Iraq that reportedly took the initiative. In March 1998, after Bin Ladin's public fatwa against the United States, two al Qaeda members reportedly went to Iraq to meet with Iraqi intelligence. In July, an Iraqi delegation traveled to Afghanistan to meet first with the Taliban and then with Bin Ladin. Sources reported that one, or perhaps both, of these meetings was apparently arranged through Bin Ladin's Egyptian deputy, Zawahiri, who had ties of his own to the Iraqis. In 1998, Iraq was under intensifying U.S. pressure, which culminated in a series of large air attacks in December.75

Similar meetings between Iraqi officials and Bin Ladin or his aides may have occurred in 1999 during a period of some reported strains with the Taliban. According to the reporting, Iraqi officials offered Bin Ladin a safe haven in Iraq. Bin Ladin declined, apparently judging that his circumstances in Afghanistan remained more favorable than the Iraqi alternative. The reports describe friendly contacts and indicate some common themes in both sides' hatred of the United States. But to date we have seen no evidence that these or the earlier contacts ever developed into a collaborative operational relationship. Nor have we seen evidence indicating that Iraq cooperated with al Qaeda in developing or carrying out any attacks against the United States.76
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post #38 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 06:42 PM
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I recall the document, which describes very little contact and no cooperation between two groups with a common enemy. Saddam wanted nothing to do with Bin Laden and Al Qaeda, he had enough problems of his own, and had no interest in Bin Laden's grandiose global objectives.....

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post #39 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 07:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diego97
this tactic of 'you dont know what youre talking about so go away until you study more' just isn't going to work. I dont care that most of you old farts spend almost every waking moment on this forum and have for years doesnt make you 'experts' because you are wrong, dead wrong, couldnt be more wrong and what we are discussing is all debateable. So i'm staying, until you fossils see the light. Seems to me the only ones on here that have a clue are jayhawk and botnst and even though i dont always agree with him, mcbear makes a lot of sense. so i'll be here a while and thanks for your concern
What you believe, whether it is in the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, or Bin Laden and Saddam's intimate relationship is irrelevant if you can't prove it with some credible back up. Either credible logic that ties events you can prove happened together or some other credible source validates. If Bush had a credible source for citing Bin Laden and Saddam had a cooperative relationship it would not be something we heard from you first. It would have been all over the news. And none of us fossils would be arguing that the relationship did not exist. But, too bad for you. There is no such relationship. And your continued reliance on such a make believe relationship to be a whole person is little more than sad.

You have basically lost all credibility. Stay if you want, maybe you can learn something. But your statements have as much on the surface credibility as a sighting of Elvis or the Easter Bunny. Jim
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post #40 of 43 (permalink) Old 04-28-2007, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by GermanStar
I recall the document, which describes very little contact and no cooperation between two groups with a common enemy. Saddam wanted nothing to do with Bin Laden and Al Qaeda, he had enough problems of his own, and had no interest in Bin Laden's grandiose global objectives.....
I recall the document as well. You could sum up Saddam's outlook as being a ruthless dictator who tolerated no competition. He viewed Ossamma as likely competition. Saddam was also no fool. A shitheaded savage maybe, but no fool. There was no sanctioned Al-Qaeda activity in Saddam's Iraq even if he didn't declare "war" on Ossama.

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