Should Israel hit Iran's nuclear facilities? - Page 5 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

View Poll Results: Should Israel hit Iran's nuclear facilities?
Yes, with our permission 5 17.24%
Yes, without our permission 16 55.17%
No, it is a violation of the international security and stability 3 10.34%
F*ck Iran and Israel 7 24.14%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 29. You may not vote on this poll

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post #41 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:16 PM
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Why that's deplorable. Are you aware that Saddam had complied with all those terms prior to March of 2003? That he had agreed to unfettered access to all of Iraq? That he had presented a full and accurate account of all WMDs? Where is the line that authorized the United States to attack Iraq? Isn't this resolution just a warning, the point of the entire thing to "deplore"? Where does it say in here that Saddam was in possesion of weapons that threatened the United States?

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address

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post #42 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by FeelTheLove
Why that's deplorable. Are you aware that Saddam had complied with all those terms prior to March of 2003? That he had agreed to unfettered access to all of Iraq? That he had presented a full and accurate account of all WMDs?

Where is the line that authorized the United States to attack Iraq? Isn't this resolution just a warning, the point of the entire thing to "deplore"? Where does it say in here that Saddam was in possesion of weapons that threatened the United States?
You're moving the target.

He agreed to everything. Lots of folks who sign contracts fail to uphold their ends of the bargains. That's why we have bankruptcy courts and wars.

He did not satisfy the requirements of the resolutions to the satisfaction of the Security Council. If you have his accounting of what became of the precursor chemicals required for making Lewisite, Mustard, and Sarin, please send that to the UN to complete their files as they are under the misapprehension that no such accounting exists.

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post #43 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:20 PM
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Here is some pics of my passport just in case you think I am full of it. It shows some of the Arab countries I described above. So yeah I have been there and I am still alive.

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post #44 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:23 PM
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United Nations S/RES/1441 (2002) Security Council Distr.: General 8 November 2002 02-68226 (E) *0268226* Resolution 1441 (2002) Adopted by the Security Council at its 4644th meeting, on 8 November 2002 The Security Council, Recalling all its previous relevant resolutions, in particular its resolutions 661 (1990) of 6 August 1990, 678 (1990) of 29 November 1990, 686 (1991) of 2 March 1991, 687 (1991) of 3 April 1991, 688 (1991) of 5 April 1991, 707 (1991) of 15 August 1991, 715 (1991) of 11 October 1991, 986 (1995) of 14 April 1995, and 1284 (1999) of 17 December 1999, and all the relevant statements of its President,

Recalling also its resolution 1382 (2001) of 29 November 2001 and its intention to implement it fully,

Recognizing the threat Iraq’s non-compliance with Council resolutions and proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and long-range missiles poses to international peace and security,

Recalling that its resolution 678 (1990) authorized Member States to use all necessary means to uphold and implement its resolution 660 (1990) of 2 August 1990 and all relevant resolutions subsequent to resolution 660 (1990) and to restore international peace and security in the area,

Further recalling that its resolution 687 (1991) imposed obligations on Iraq as a necessary step for achievement of its stated objective of restoring international peace and security in the area,

Deploring the fact that Iraq has not provided an accurate, full, final, and complete disclosure, as required by resolution 687 (1991), of all aspects of its programmes to develop weapons of mass destruction and ballistic missiles with a range greater than one hundred and fifty kilometres, and of all holdings of such weapons, their components and production facilities and locations, as well as all other nuclear programmes, including any which it claims are for purposes not related to nuclear-weapons-usable material,

Deploring further that Iraq repeatedly obstructed immediate, unconditional, and unrestricted access to sites designated by the United Nations Special Commission (UNSCOM) and the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), failed to cooperate fully and unconditionally with UNSCOM and IAEA weapons

etc
Mr. Botsnst, can you explain these statements?:
"
Iraq agreed to the Resolution on November 13. Weapons inspectors returned on November 27, led by Hans Blix of UNMOVIC and Mohamed ElBaradei of the IAEA. The inspectors had been absent from Iraq since December 1998 when they were withdrawn immediately prior to Operation Desert Fox

Inspectors began visiting sites where WMD production was suspected, but found no evidence of such activities. As was discovered after the invasion of Iraq, no production of WMDs was taking place, and no stockpiles existed. Debate about Resolution 1441 therefore turns on whether, despite the absence of WMDs and the acceptance of inspections, Iraq failed to comply with the terms of the Resolution, and whether an invasion was justified in the absence of any further UN Security resolutions on the subject.

On December 7, 2002, Iraq filed its 12,000-page weapons declaration with the UN in order to meet requirements for this resolution. The five permanent members of the Security Council received unedited versions of the report, while an edited version was made available for other UN Member States. On December 19, Hans Blix reported before the United Nations and stated in regards to Iraq's December 7 report (unedited version): "During the period 1991-1998, Iraq submitted many declarations called full, final and complete. Regrettably, much in these declarations proved inaccurate or incomplete or was unsupported or contradicted by evidence. In such cases, no confidence can arise that proscribed programmes or items have been eliminated." By March, Blix declared that the December 7 report had not brought any new documentary evidence to light.
"

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #45 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:24 PM
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post #46 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Botnst
Knowledge is nothing without wisdom. Ask an encyclopaedia.

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Maybe I need to watch FOX more to gain wisdom
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post #47 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:25 PM
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What matters is that I mingled with these people unlike many that just watch CNN to get an idea what they are about
Mingled?

Not good enough!

Unless you LIVED with them while in the Peace Corps and where given a native name, you were just another ugly American tourist.

That is what a scruffy Peace Corp rat told me on the shore of Lake Atitlan in Guatemala in order to dispell any feeling I may have that I was doing anything special backpacking up from El Salvador to Mexico. Of course I quickly used a local idiom to basically ask some locals,"Who does this ass-wipe think he is?" in Spanish.

He hit back with, "I refuse to learn the language of the Imperialist, I am learning Caciquel...the Mayan dialect."

Of course the natives thought he was a spoiled kid. They called him "Ricocito" which he thought was the diminutive form of Ricardo because his name was Richard.

(Pobrecito means "poor little thing"...rico is "rich")

I have never met such a self-absorbed person so unaware that he was being mocked.
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post #48 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:27 PM
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Here is some pics of my passport just in case you think I am full of it. It shows some of the Arab countries I described above. So yeah I have been there and I am still alive.
I have no reason to doubt you. I think that is amazing. Travel opens the mind like nothing else.
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post #49 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:27 PM
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You qualify as ONE HELL OF A FASCINATING dinner partner.

But you asked ME the question, Prof. Don't get snooty on me.

I assume that your point was to query as to whether I had some narrow view of Islam, Muslims, Muslim countries, etc.

I don't.

By the way, I would never seriously suggest that you are stupid or uneducated. Why is that such a habit of lefties? I may disagree with your opinions or conclusions, but I would never be so arrogant to write you off as "a idiot". Saying, "You are an idiot" doesn't count. That is a friendly way of saying, "I disagree."

So what's your fucking point, Prof?

That it is possible to see the world on a teacher's salary?
I was not a teacher when I did those trips.
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post #50 of 119 (permalink) Old 12-07-2006, 06:28 PM
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You're moving the target.

He agreed to everything. Lots of folks who sign contracts fail to uphold their ends of the bargains. That's why we have bankruptcy courts and wars.

He did not satisfy the requirements of the resolutions to the satisfaction of the Security Council. If you have his accounting of what became of the precursor chemicals required for making Lewisite, Mustard, and Sarin, please send that to the UN to complete their files as they are under the misapprehension that no such accounting exists.

Bot
Can you explain this, then?

"Factual questions about the Iraqi declaration still remain. To date the contents have still not been made public for independent scrutiny.[11] When the UK government was asked to state where in the Iraqi government's declaration there were false or inaccurate statements, the reply was that it was a confidential matter and that "huge quantities of documents remain to be translated."

There has not yet been any proof on record that there were inaccuracies in the declaration. The Iraq Survey Group showed that how little there was to declare anyway, and the small fragments that remain cannot be checked against the document to see if they were listed."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UN_Secu...esolution_1441

And you say "He did not satisfy the requirements of the resolutions to the satisfaction of the Security Council."

How can that be true if the Security Council refused to authorize UN action against Saddam? How can they be satisfied he was not a threat and not satisified at the same time? If what you assert is true, why did the US block a vote on it's own motion to invade Iraq?

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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