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post #41 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-11-2007, 08:29 AM
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Lets just send some troops there and kill, kill, kill. Then we can hang Chavez. Were good at that kinda thing it seems.
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post #42 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-11-2007, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Zeitgeist
Like it or not, Chavez is a product of both his times and the general will of the people within Latin Merka. I say power to the people and let them ride this wave and see where it goes. Can't possibly be worse than what folks down there have endured for the last few centuries.
That really is true. Capitalism produced an electorate that was mostly poor, and if you are rock bottom, lets eat some rats poor, communism becomes the most attractive system, doesn't it? Oh, and by the way, you, and everyone else here, sucks.
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post #43 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-11-2007, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Zeitgeist
Like it or not, Chavez is a product of both his times and the general will of the people within Latin Merka. I say power to the people and let them ride this wave and see where it goes. Can't possibly be worse than what folks down there have endured for the last few centuries.
He reminds me an awful lot of a certain Argentinian of days past.

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post #44 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-11-2007, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Botnst
Yes, snubbing him is a good idea. He is an anti-democratic thug.

OTOH, that does not mean that we need to seek his ouster. On the contrary, he was democratically elected to a nation that has refused, for 150 years, to observe it's founders' dreams or even their constitution. The government had been in the hands of a few dozen inbred family factions that traded power and parasitized the nation's wealth through subverting democracy.

The people were so sick of that abuse that they elected a thug to expunge the crooks.

We don't suck his cock, nor do we shoot him. Just leave him alone and treat the nation normally. Hopefully they'll sort it out over time.

More interesting (and far more likely to suck us into direct involvement) will be when the Mexicans decide they have had enough of their similarly corrupted and subverted system. I think Mexico is far more likely to enter a protracted, bloody revolution than Venezuela. With 10 M 1st gen Mexicans illegally living here and no telling how many 1st gen legally here, we will have a huge constituency pushing us for direct involvement.

You just think Chalabi had influence.

Good one Bot. I can only add Ortega.
The Countries South of the border have been robbed and their people disenfranchised by the Hombres de Siempre, the men of always, throughout their history. If a socialist system on a democratic foundation could be made to work to benefit all the people, it actually might be the best solution for them.
Two out of 10 Mexican workers are now in the U.S., while Mexico is considered to be the richest Country in Central and South America.
The U.S. should use its influence to affect system changes, and stop supporting every bloodthirsty piss pot dictator.
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post #45 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-23-2007, 05:57 PM
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Who needs representative democracy?

Throngs in Venezuela protest Chavez plan
By FABIOLA SANCHEZ, Associated Press Writer 38 minutes ago
CARACAS, Venezuela

Blowing whistles and waving flags, hundreds of Venezuelans protested Tuesday against a congressional measure that would grant President Hugo Chavez the power to pass laws by decree in areas from the economy to defense.

Some 400 to 500 protesters stood in a Caracas plaza and shouted in unison: "Faced with authoritarianism, more democracy!"

The protest came as lawmakers in the entirely pro-Chavez National Assembly announced they would postpone until next Tuesday a session to grant final approval of a so-called "enabling law" allowing Chavez to enact laws by decree during an 18-month period. Chavez is seeking special powers to quickly push through changes from nationalizing electrical companies to imposing new taxes on the rich.

Many protesters said the measure would give Chavez carte blanche to legislate in a list of vaguely specified areas without checks or balances.

"It gives him total power," said Greys Pulido, 40. "We don't want a dictatorship."

Chavez, who was re-elected by a wide margin last month, says he is committed to democracy and is overseeing changes that will give a greater voice in decision-making to poor Venezuelans.

Opposition leaders presented the National Assembly with a document demanding their voices be heard as the government draws up the "enabling law," plus separate constitutional reforms that could eliminate presidential term limits, which now bar Chavez from running in 2012.

In a stinging public rebuke, former Chavez confidant and Cabinet member Luis Miquilena said the president "is doing whatever he wants and doesn't abide by any rule."

The 87-year-old former interior minister has largely maintained a low profile since resigning from Chavez's government in early 2002, but on Tuesday he told reporters: "This is a government with a hypocritical authoritarianism that tries to sell the world certain democratic appearances."

The broadly worded bill approved in a first reading last week would let Chavez issue decrees in areas such as creating a "new economic and social model," "the transformation of the state," and "security and defense."
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post #46 of 47 (permalink) Old 01-23-2007, 06:29 PM
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Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #47 of 47 (permalink) Old 04-11-2008, 01:09 PM
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Is Hugo Chavez Friends with FARC?

By Jens Glüsing

A spectacular find may prove what many have long suspected. E-mails and other files found on a FARC laptop in the jungles of Ecuador show that Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez may have close relations with the terror group.

When police stormed a house near San José, the capital of Costa Rica, they knew exactly what they were looking for. Immediately, the officers headed for a backroom where they found an old safe packed with bundles of dollars -- wrapped like cocaine in plastic.

Many of the bills were stuck together; some were already so rotten that they could hardly be counted. But the police knew the sum anyway: $480,000 (€305,000). The cash had been mentioned by Raul Reyes -- the number-two man in the Colombian Marxist guerrilla organization known as the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) -- in an e-mail to Rodrigo Granda, known as the "chancellor" of the rebel group. Granda was to use the money to finance international activities. The address where the stash was to be found was also mentioned in the message.

The $480,000 e-mail was one of hundreds of documents found on Reyes’ laptop. Colombian troops had killed the sleeping guerrilla leader in early March during a pre-dawn bombing raid on a FARC camp in Ecuador -- and secured the laptop. It was found together with three other computers and a number of compact discs in a suitcase that survived the attack.

30 Kilos of Uranium
Interpol specialists are currently analyzing the recovered data. Some of the information has been encrypted, but most of the files are easily accessible.
Reyes felt safe in his camp, less than two kilometers (1.25 miles) from the Colombian border. In roughly two weeks, Interpol Secretary General Ronald Noble plans to announce the results of the investigation. But one thing is already clear: the laptops contain a political bombshell. They hold detailed information on FARC's relations outside of Colombia, the group' finances, their smuggling routes and records for cocaine deliveries. There are also details of bomb attacks carried out be the group.

The seized files also allowed police to track down 30 kilos (66 pounds) of uranium, which had been hidden in a village near the Colombian capital Bogotá and possibly belonged to the guerrillas. Although the material is not suitable for manufacturing bombs, it could be used to produce special ammunition capable of piercing armored vehicles.

Reyes also refers to negotiations with the French government on the possible release of former Colombian presidential candidate Ingrid Betancourt. In an e-mail to the top rebel commander, he complains that the French-Colombian -- who has been held hostage by the FARC for over six years -- is stubborn and tries to take advantage of her intellectual superiority. Meanwhile, Betancourt’s health has become so poor that Paris sent a plane to Bogotá last Thursday equipped with medical supplies manned by doctors to give her emergency care in the event of her release.

But the most important man exposed by the files on the laptop is Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez -- the same man who threatened his Colombian counterpart Alvaro Uribe with war following the cross-border raid against Reyes. Now it’s clear why: Chavez apparently does more than just sympathize with the guerrillas in his neighboring country -- he also supports them with money and arms.

Boon for the Guerrillas
Reyes’ posthumous electronic correspondence reveals that Chavez had planned a meeting with legendary FARC leader Manual Marulanda, and he wanted to invite Nicaragua’s head of state Daniel Ortega and Bolivian President Evo Morales. Another e-mail refers to a “dossier” of over $300 million for the FARC. The government in the Venezuelan capital Caracas also apparently offered the rebels a share in the country's oil business and promised decommissioned arms from the country’s own army.

Chavez insists that he has never sent the rebels money or arms. After the saber rattling with Colombian leader Uribe, he is portraying himself as a man of peace. But former rebels and intelligence experts confirm the connection with the guerrillas.

Chavez discovered his sympathy for the Marxist rebels in the early 1990s. At the time, he was a member of a group of rebellious officers who drew their ideological inspiration from the Marxist insurgent movements of the 1960s and '70s in Colombia and Venezuela. Following an attempted coup against then President Carlos Andres Perez, Chavez landed in prison. A cash injection from the FARC allegedly helped him out of his financial squeeze at the time.

more at: Dangerous Liaison: Is Hugo Chavez Friends with FARC? - International - SPIEGEL ONLINE - News

The biggest problems we are facing right now have to do with George Bush trying to bring more and more power into the executive branch and not go through Congress at all and thats what I intend to reverse.

~ Senator Barack H. Obama
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