Originally Posted by Bruce R.
Jimmy, maybe you ought to read what was written before you make a statement like the above. Relativity was not in question, who was elected to leadership was. You can't get much higher in leadership then the President, and the Democraps elected LBJ to run for VP. I think we all know that he eventually made it to President.
Bruthie, it is you who should read what was written, you little wascal! No one was bringing up the issue of why the people in Trent Lott's state elected him, it was that the Republican, minority, in the Senate, selected him as the minority party's whip. That was not an "election" on the order of a Presidential election. It was back room, power brokering, party politics with no view of how it would be percieved by the public in the bright sunlight of the day after the Republican Party got the boot for being dirty and unethical, and running blatant anti-minority political ads. It is literally as though nothing has changed, just like The Who lyrics quoted above.
Originally Posted by Bruce R.
Jimmy, again you try to lead this "conversation" in another direction. Murtha was dumped as you say, in part for his shadey dealings in the past, but at least one other reason was his "cut and run" philosophy.
Since the Democraps don't seem to have developed any sort of stratagy to get out of Iraq other then call the President stupid, they have to leave ALL options open. Murtha eliminates (or certainly limits) pretty much all other possibilities except for cut and run.
As far as "the new standard" is concerned, well, I think they're still trying to figure just what that means. No problems though, it's not 2007 yet is it...........
No Bruthie, you little grasshopper. In this case it is you who attempt to argue against the context of the original post in this thread. Now, I agree we have a national debate to get through on what to do about Iraq. There are but two choices however, and no matter how hard you try to argue for the "stay the course" path to hell, it is not one of them any longer.
It comes down to making Iraq an international effort with overwhelming force to shut down then restart Iraq again in a sequence that hands over a stable infrastructure to the new government, or, to use your phrase made of words selected to make it unappealing from an emotional level and avoid a cold, logical assessment, "cut and run."
It really means, we as a nation, go to confession, and start out confessing to Iraqi people that have screwed their country up beyond our ability to fix it, and ask their forgiveness, and make a committment to help them fix it once they get their act together. And then we leave. Some would like to see us try to negotiate some deal with the surrounding countries, which at this point, is another formula for fucking up since we have no diplomatic core left. They were never valued by the cowboy administration, and so, the bench is empty. No really skilled diplomatic players means, don't put some klutz like Bolton in the role of diplomat. He and the rest of the types like him in Bush's first string team of morons don't have the basic comprehension of the workings of diplomacy, and they will end up negotiating with force, armed force, instead of an understanding of the situation, and good negotiating skills. Jim