The Valerie Plame Affair - Page 3 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #21 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-28-2006, 08:55 PM
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Before you finish congratulating yourself you might want to check your facts. Armitage is a hawk by all accounts. All accounts.
No shit. He's a PNAC signer:

http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqclintonletter.htm

It's all part of the cover up. Right wing disinformation machine is roaring into gear to paint him as some kind of neutral party. PNAC=NAZI. Armitage is a full fledged member of The Party.

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #22 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-28-2006, 09:05 PM
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Take a look at this PNAC crowd. These nuts were put in charge of this country, and hijacked 9-11 to carry out this policy they had advocated years before it happened. Read the 1998 letter and look where the ended up in BushCo:

Paul Wolfowitz: Deputy Secretary of Defense who engineered the mass murder air attacks against Iraqi civilian population centers in March 2003

Richard Perle: Planned the Hitler-style invasion of Iraq for the Dept of Defense

Elliott Abrams: Deputy National Security advisor, black ops specialist in charge of NSA spy-on-US-citizens program

Richard L. Armitage: PNAC spy sent to State Dept to keep tabs on Powell

William J. Bennett: noted AM Talk Show fascist, shadow Minister of Propaganda

William Kristol: Head of Weekly Standard disinformation machine

John Bolton: Bush's ambassador to the UN, who hates the UN

Zalmay Khalilzad: US Ambassador to Iraq, in other words, the guy in charge of our puppet government

Donald Rumsfeld: Need I say more

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address

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post #23 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-28-2006, 09:11 PM Thread Starter
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And yet after years of investigation and millions of dollars spent by a special prosecutor still not a shred of evidence that the White House "outed" Valerie Plame.

And that's what this thread is all about, your dissaembling rantings notwithstanding....

Last edited by baby boo; 08-28-2006 at 09:14 PM.
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post #24 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-29-2006, 12:11 AM
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A comparison of monies spent for political investigations on a pretext would make both parties look rather foolish. The Valery Plame affair was shameful though. From his three year duty as deputy chief of mission in Baghdad, Joe Wilson was not only familiar with Iraq, but knew Saddam on a personal level. First in Feb. 2002 the CIA sends him to Niger on a fact finding missin on whether Iraq tried to buy yellowcake, then they dont like the facts he brings back. Who but the White House profited from muzzling the former ambassador and his wife? When it comes to the illustrious member of Goverment, if dishonesty and lying were an issue, few politicians would be left in the Country, no matter their affiliation. http://wiki/Joseph_C._Wilson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Plame
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post #25 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-29-2006, 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Teutone
A comparison of monies spent for political investigations on a pretext would make both parties look rather foolish. The Valery Plame affair was shameful though. From his three year duty as deputy chief of mission in Baghdad, Joe Wilson was not only familiar with Iraq, but knew Saddam on a personal level. First in Feb. 2002 the CIA sends him to Niger on a fact finding missin on whether Iraq tried to buy yellowcake, then they dont like the facts he brings back. Who but the White House profited from muzzling the former ambassador and his wife? When it comes to the illustrious member of Goverment, if dishonesty and lying were an issue, few politicians would be left in the Country, no matter their affiliation. http://wiki/Joseph_C._Wilson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Plame
It maybe true that Wilson knew a lot about Saddam, but apparently he wasn't so good at finding clues to the nuke program.

Armitage may have been a signer of that letter but he was definitely on the outs at the Whtehouse or they'd not have ejected him when Powell left.

Wowie ZahawieSorry everyone, but Iraq did go uranium shopping in Niger.
By Christopher Hitchens
Posted Monday, April 10, 2006, at 4:43 PM ET

In the late 1980s, the Iraqi representative to the International Atomic Energy Agency—Iraq's senior public envoy for nuclear matters, in effect—was a man named Wissam al-Zahawie. After the Kuwait war in 1991, when Rolf Ekeus arrived in Baghdad to begin the inspection and disarmament work of UNSCOM, he was greeted by Zahawie, who told him in a bitter manner that "now that you have come to take away our assets," the two men could no longer be friends. (They had known each other in earlier incarnations at the United Nations in New York.)

At a later 1995 U.N. special session on the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, Zahawie was the Iraqi delegate and spoke heatedly about the urgent need to counterbalance Israel's nuclear capacity. At the time, most democratic countries did not have full diplomatic relations with Saddam's regime, and there were few fully accredited Iraqi ambassadors overseas, Iraq's interests often being represented by the genocidal Islamist government of Sudan (incidentally, yet another example of collusion between "secular" Baathists and the fundamentalists who were sheltering Osama Bin Laden). There was one exception—an Iraqi "window" into the world of open diplomacy—namely the mutual recognition between the Baathist regime and the Vatican. To this very important and sensitive post in Rome, Zahawie was appointed in 1997, holding the job of Saddam's ambassador to the Holy See until 2000. Those who knew him at that time remember a man much given to anti-Jewish tirades, with a standing ticket for Wagner performances at Bayreuth. (Actually, as a fan of Das Rheingold and Götterdämmerung in particular, I find I can live with this. Hitler secretly preferred sickly kitsch like Franz Lehar.)

In February 1999, Zahawie left his Vatican office for a few days and paid an official visit to Niger, a country known for absolutely nothing except its vast deposits of uranium ore. It was from Niger that Iraq had originally acquired uranium in 1981, as confirmed in the Duelfer Report. In order to take the Joseph Wilson view of this Baathist ambassadorial initiative, you have to be able to believe that Saddam Hussein's long-term main man on nuclear issues was in Niger to talk about something other than the obvious. Italian intelligence (which first noticed the Zahawie trip from Rome) found it difficult to take this view and alerted French intelligence (which has better contacts in West Africa and a stronger interest in nuclear questions). In due time, the French tipped off the British, who in their cousinly way conveyed the suggestive information to Washington. As everyone now knows, the disclosure appeared in watered-down and secondhand form in the president's State of the Union address in January 2003.

If the above was all that was known, it would surely be universally agreed that no responsible American administration could have overlooked such an amazingly sinister pattern. Given the past Iraqi record of surreptitious dealing, cheating of inspectors, concealment of sites and caches, and declared ambition to equip the technicians referred to openly in the Baathist press as "nuclear mujahideen," one could scarcely operate on the presumption of innocence.

However, the waters have since become muddied, to say the least. For a start, someone produced a fake document, dated July 6, 2000, which purports to show Zahawie's signature and diplomatic seal on an actual agreement for an Iraqi uranium transaction with Niger. Almost everything was wrong with this crude forgery—it had important dates scrambled, and it misstated the offices of Niger politicians. In consequence, IAEA Chairman Mohammed ElBaradei later reported to the U.N. Security Council that the papers alleging an Iraq-Niger uranium connection had been demonstrated to be fraudulent.

But this doesn't alter the plain set of established facts in my first three paragraphs above. The European intelligence services, and the Bush administration, only ever asserted that the Iraqi regime had apparently tried to open (or rather, reopen) a yellowcake trade "in Africa." It has never been claimed that an agreement was actually reached. What motive could there be for a forgery that could be instantly detected upon cursory examination?

There seem to be only three possibilities here. Either a) American intelligence concocted the note; b) someone in Italy did so in the hope of gain; or c) it was the product of disinformation, intended to protect Niger and discredit any attention paid to the actual, real-time Zahawie visit. The CIA is certainly incompetent enough to have fouled up this badly. (I like Edward Luttwak's formulation in the March 22 Times Literary Supplement, where he writes that "there have been only two kinds of CIA secret operations: the ones that are widely known to have failed—usually because of almost unbelievably crude errors—and the ones that are not yet widely known to have failed.") Still, it almost passes belief that any American agency would fake a document that purportedly proved far more than the administration had asked and then get every important name and date wrapped round the axle. Forgery for gain is easy to understand, especially when it is borne in mind that nobody wastes time counterfeiting a bankrupt currency. Forgery for disinformation, if that is what it was, appears at least to have worked. Almost everybody in the world now affects to believe that Saddam Hussein was framed on the Niger rap.

According to the London Sunday Times of April 9, the truth appears to be some combination of b) and c). A NATO investigation has identified two named employees of the Niger Embassy in Rome who, having sold a genuine document about Zahawie to Italian and French intelligence agents, then added a forged paper in the hope of turning a further profit. The real stuff went by one route to Washington, and the fakery, via an Italian journalist and the U.S. Embassy in Rome, by another. The upshot was—follow me closely here—that a phony paper alleging a deal was used to shoot down a genuine document suggesting a connection.

Zahawie's name and IAEA connection were never mentioned by ElBaradei in his report to the United Nations, and his past career has never surfaced in print. Looking up the press of the time causes one's jaw to slump in sheer astonishment. Here, typically, is a Time magazine "exclusive" about Zahawie, written by Hassan Fattah on Oct. 1, 2003:

The veteran diplomat has spent the eight months since President Bush's speech trying to set the record straight and clear his name. In a rare interview with Time, al-Zahawie outlined how forgery and circumstantial evidence was used to talk up Iraq's nuclear weapons threat, and leave him holding the smoking gun.

A few paragraphs later appear, the wonderful and unchallenged words from Zahawie: "Frankly, I didn't know that Niger produced uranium at all." Well, sorry for the inconvenience of the questions, then, my old IAEA and NPT "veteran" (whose nuclear qualifications go unmentioned in the Time article). Instead, we are told that Zahawie visited Niger and other West African countries to encourage them to break the embargo on flights to Baghdad, as they had broken the sanctions on Qaddafi's Libya. A bit of a lowly mission, one might think, for one of the Iraqi regime's most senior and specialized envoys.

The Duelfer Report also cites "a second contact between Iraq and Niger," which occurred in 2001, when a Niger minister visited Baghdad "to request assistance in obtaining petroleum products to alleviate Niger's economic problems." According to the deposition of Ja'far Diya' Ja'far (the head of Iraq's pre-1991 nuclear weapons program), these negotiations involved no offer of uranium ore but only "cash in exchange for petroleum." West Africa is awash in petroleum, and Niger is poor in cash. Iraq in 2001 was cash-rich through the oil-for-food racket, but you may if you wish choose to believe that a near-bankrupt African delegation from a uranium-based country traveled across a continent and a half with nothing on its mind but shopping for oil.

Interagency feuding has ruined the Bush administration's capacity to make its case in public, and a high-level preference for deniable leaking has further compounded the problem. But please read my first three paragraphs again and tell me if the original story still seems innocuous to you.
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post #26 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-29-2006, 05:31 AM
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FTL is from Vegas???
Sometimes he's from Cunnittiket, sometimes he's from Houston. I don't think he's been from Vegas yet.

B
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post #27 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-29-2006, 06:00 AM
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Hi Bot. Thanks for the info. I should think that this kind of shopping would be easier in Russia's former Republics anyhow. Too many poorly or not at all being paid security personell doing thankless work in the middle of nowhere, and an offer of a pile of cash makes for a dangerous mix.
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post #28 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-29-2006, 01:02 PM
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Gee, they said the same thing about Paula Jones.
The two situations have nothing in commom.

Valerie Plame is hot. Flaming hot.
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post #29 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-29-2006, 01:24 PM
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Oh, they'll have a lot in common when Bush has to get on the witness stand, just like when Bill got on there. Payback's a bitch, ain't it?
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post #30 of 217 (permalink) Old 08-29-2006, 01:58 PM
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Originally Posted by FeelTheLove
Oh, they'll have a lot in common when Bush has to get on the witness stand, just like when Bill got on there. Payback's a bitch, ain't it?
Dude - you should slow down, or else your frantic masturbatory posting may result in permanent disfigurement...

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