COURT: NSA Wiretaps Must End - Page 13 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #121 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-23-2006, 06:27 PM
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So, sodomy is something you think you can prevent by law?

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #122 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-23-2006, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Botnst
he has his hand on the wires controlling my jaw. Watch, he can type while I drink a glass of water. It's all good.

Oh yeah, I can also read what he wrote and I thought it was pretty clear. What gave you problems?

B
Sounds kinky. Is there a 4th Amendment sodomy angle to your post too?

Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #123 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-23-2006, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by FeelTheLove
Sounds kinky. Is there a 4th Amendment sodomy angle to your post too?
Dude, your sig is an ad for tripod...

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post #124 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-23-2006, 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by FeelTheLove
Sounds kinky. Is there a 4th Amendment sodomy angle to your post too?
I don't give a damn who has sex with whom (or what) just so it is consensual and that children aren't involved. Is that clear?
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post #125 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-23-2006, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by QBNCGAR
Implicit distrust of everything in the government isn't "healthy skepticism" or "realistic"...it's cynicism and paranoia. That's basically where I get off the conspiracy train. It may end up that I'm just terribly naive, but I for one would find it prohibitively difficult to operate day-to-day if I had to think about all the ways the government COULD be screwing me if they wanted to.



You make leaps here that I'm not comfortable making. I won't argue the WMD case, because we've done it before and it's fruitless - I backed the decision before the WMD thing, so I could care whether or not they're around...ol' boy had to go. I don't think it's FEMA's fault that the government of Louisiana is rife with corruption and incompetency. I don't think "we the people" ever invested our 'trust' in how the DoD executes against a military strategy, because it's none of our business (I'll concede that what IS our business is where, when, and WHY we go to war). Observations on the execution are irrelevant - the performance will speak for itself. Also, I'm not sure at what point I 'trusted the Administration to shrink the economy'...the health of the economy won't matter squat if none of us are alive to see it.



Obviously a number of people associate this to McCarthyism. I think that's nearly too silly to entertain as a point of discussion. This situation is night and day different than the one in 1950's America. The focus is outward, not inward...we're trying to identify foreigners who wish to kill us, not citizens sympathetic to their cause. You can believe there's more to it than that, which I welcome, because even though it's not true, the presence of such suspicion probably ultimately serves to keep people in line.

I don't want to appear as an apologist for Bush or the NSA, but I'm not going to tolerate people holding a double-standard with regard to government's adherence to and enforcement of the law, simply because it provides those people a convenient avenue to publicly skewer an increasingly (and sometimes unfairly) embattled president. If you want to get bent out of shape about the government's failures to respect the laws of the land, there are MANY more insidious examples that go ignored every day...examples that have a REAL impact on the lives and pocketbooks of Americans who play by the rules.
The point of my post was not paranoia but to show that a "realist" approach was equally inappropriate. To suggest that this administration was moving along fine and that your "realism" as opposed to others more "illogical" look at it was the correct course was the flaw I was pointing out. It was condescending to suggest that only your "realism" was the appropriate and sound approach to take. Everything else was, as you try to discount, paranoid, silly, irrelevant, leaping, conspiracy and cynical.

You made my point very well with your rebuttal.

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Last edited by mcbear; 08-23-2006 at 10:12 PM.
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post #126 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-23-2006, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by baby boo
I have a problem with people contruing the fourth amendment as endorsing a "right to sodomy."
Are you referring to the question of what goes on behind closed doors in a private bedroom? I am guessing that is what you are questioning the endorsement of on the right to sodomy?

Does your question include married couples [heterosexual], single adult couples [heterosexual] also? Reason I ask is that there are several states that still have sodomy laws on the books that preclude sodomy 'oral' between married couples and consenting single adults. Does that endorsement of "right to sodomy" effect any of your vacation plans?

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post #127 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-23-2006, 10:33 PM
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Very Good Popular Science Article

Just read this while in the Doc office this morning. An interesting take on the subject at hand.

http://www.popsci.com/popsci/technol...cbccdrcrd.html

Paranoia will annoya.

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post #128 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-24-2006, 06:19 AM
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Originally Posted by mcbear
Just read this while in the Doc office this morning. An interesting take on the subject at hand.

http://www.popsci.com/popsci/technol...cbccdrcrd.html

Paranoia will annoya.
"Subject at hand...", snicker.

An Hungarian (I think) mathematician named Erdos began formalizing this analysis (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erdős_number , www.oakland.edu/enp/ , mathworld.wolfram.com/ErdosNumber.html )

As a pure number, it is nearly without value. I have an Erdos Number with Erdos of 3, which gives me an Erdos Number (a friend of mine met Erdos at a mathematics seminar while he was a grad student) with Albert Einstein Number of 4 (Erdos worked with Einstein), which means everybody I have ever met has an Albert Einstein number of 5. I'll bet that everybody on the planet has an Einstein number less than 10. The Botnst Conjecture is that everybody has less than or equal to 10 degrees of separation.

To add weight to linkages, how about some measure of time in proximity between each linkage? Thus, a fleeting handshake may have a time-weight of 1 while a lifetime marriage might have a linkage weight of 5, for example. How about filial weights? Political weights? Financial weights? How do these various weights interact with each other? Are they orthogonal? Etc.

And thus the problem shifts from the one dimensional to the hyperdimensional and we have another clue as to why NSA has the largest networked supercomputer system in the world.
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post #129 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-24-2006, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Botnst
"Subject at hand...", snicker.

An Hungarian (I think) mathematician named Erdos began formalizing this analysis (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erdős_number , www.oakland.edu/enp/ , mathworld.wolfram.com/ErdosNumber.html )

As a pure number, it is nearly without value. I have an Erdos Number with Erdos of 3, which gives me an Erdos Number (a friend of mine met Erdos at a mathematics seminar while he was a grad student) with Albert Einstein Number of 4 (Erdos worked with Einstein), which means everybody I have ever met has an Albert Einstein number of 5. I'll bet that everybody on the planet has an Einstein number less than 10. The Botnst Conjecture is that everybody has less than or equal to 10 degrees of separation.

To add weight to linkages, how about some measure of time in proximity between each linkage? Thus, a fleeting handshake may have a time-weight of 1 while a lifetime marriage might have a linkage weight of 5, for example. How about filial weights? Political weights? Financial weights? How do these various weights interact with each other? Are they orthogonal? Etc.

And thus the problem shifts from the one dimensional to the hyperdimensional and we have another clue as to why NSA has the largest networked supercomputer system in the world.
When I played with an alpha of Carnivore we used a room full of IBM 3090's with MPP [Massively Parallel Processors]. They are three generations of processors and four generations of planars ahead of that now which pretty much would allow for your very multidimentional "spherical logic" searches. Spherical logic searches is where each jump off point of the search is in the center of a sphere with unlimited points on the surface of the sphere to tag for data. The size of the sphere is dependant on the amount of processor power at hand to determine number of "points". Each tag point then becomes the next sphere. When it works, it is smokin. It is also very very scary.

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post #130 of 151 (permalink) Old 08-24-2006, 01:38 PM
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The mods didn't like my Bush thing.
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