Originally Posted by JimSmith
Try answering what freedoms and liberties you are willing to cede to the government because of the war on terror, or what other present day conditions you believe warrant such actions. Please explain why it is more important for the longevity of our nation and our values to give these freedoms up instead of figure out how to face the threat and win, without giving up these freedoms and liberties.
A little aside to this very good discussion.
My brother had a bit of a run-in with the Feds. He relates a story on car salesman. Apparently, there are quite a few car salesman in the Federal Pens. How would this be possible, you say?
Well, the car salesman accepted a cash payment for the vehicle. Naturally, they duly reported the cash sale to the government, as required by law. But, the government responded by indicting the car salesman on charges because the car salesman should have realized that the cash was coming from an illegal activity. The case hinges on whether the government can prove that the salesman "should have known".
But, like almost every federal indictment, there is insufficient resources to defend oneself against the Feds, and the consequences of a loss at trial would be a sentence that is 4X longer than the plea. Additionally, the Feds typically don't take a loss lightly and may attempt to indict the individual on another charge such as tax evasion. Therefore, rightly or wrongly, 98% of all Federal indictments are plead out.
The Feds have no desire to see justice done. They simply have a quota to meet. If you want to cause a load of hurt on someone, just drop a dime to the Feds with a bit of factual info.
He has other stories on how the Feds sent a 70 year old man to jail for 5 years because he couldn't repay a loan to a bank after 9/11. Seems the bank found an error in his loan application from 10 years ago and dropped a dime to the Feds. Since the loan was 5 million dollars, and was, by definition, fraudlently obtained due to the error on the application, this poor SOB got 5 years in the big house. Was justice served here?
Yep, it's quite the government that this administration is operating. The things that the average citizen doesn't hear will turn your stomach.