This just in: Jesus NOT a Republican - Page 5 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #41 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 07:56 AM
Surely A Large Human
 
Qubes's Avatar
 
Date registered: Jun 2006
Vehicle: '08 C219
Location: Between Earth and Mars
Posts: 34,252
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Quoted: 493 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
I'd disagree (of course) - DBP cast a blanket big enough to cover half of America, essentially drawing a parallel between ALL Republicans and these a$$hole televangelists. As a republican, that, to me, is pretty much an attack.

I detest the religious right, and yet I am a conservative. I can't vote democrat, as it seems that party is intent on aligning itself with the far left rather than the mainstream. I consider it a fact that in practice, liberalism (especially in the form of 'compassionate' social policies), despite it's best intentions, ends up doing more harm than good.

Therefore I vote Republican. DBP blasted all of them, effectively saying we're all either sheisters or "morons from Kansas". There's no basis for that statement - it's just spewing BS at the mouth, which is the hallmark of liberal democrats. How is that not an attack? Why should anyone have to suffer that?

I'll certainly take responsibility for my actions - I think it frankly ridiculous to claim that conservatives are the ones with an aversion to taking responsibility for their own actions. There's not enough time in my day to start citing the examples of this with liberals, but certainly Roe v. Wade leaps immediately to mind. If you consider it 'unfair' or an 'attack' to infer that liberals are in support of laws allowing unfettered access to a womb for the purpose of murdering an unborn human beings in the name of personal convenience, then you know how it feels to be labeled an idiot/snake-oil salesman just because I don't happen to agree.

Last edited by Qubes; 06-27-2006 at 08:01 AM.
Qubes is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #42 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 08:47 AM
CH4S Artist
 
Teutone's Avatar
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 1985 500SEC, 1991 190E 2.6.
Location: Los Angeles / Hannover Germany
Posts: 33,569
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Quoted: 957 Post(s)
Lifetime Premium Member
I have no sympathies for either party. The prevailing voter apathy shows that a large part of the population has given up on the political process. At the same time, the polarization of capital continues. Not a healthy situation, that could eventually turn into a social boomerang. The attitude in Washington seems to be, :"In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is King."
Teutone is offline  
post #43 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 12:44 PM
BenzWorld Senior Member
 
felkhound's Avatar
 
Date registered: Nov 2005
Vehicle: 2006 SLK350
Location: North Little Rock, AR
Posts: 544
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
We just need to add a new third party "None of the Above". If none of the above gets the majority of votes, then each party must submit a new candidate and try again. Give me someone to vote for that we can support, not just the lesser of two evils picked by some maple syrup farmer in New Hampshire.

2006 SLK350
Something Silver

“I’m sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and disagree with this administration, somehow you’re not patriotic. We need to stand up and say we’re Americans, and we have the right to debate and disagree with any administration.”
- Hillary Clinton
felkhound is offline  
post #44 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 03:31 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Gregs300CD's Avatar
 
Date registered: May 2005
Vehicle: 1982 300CD
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 5,044
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)
I think it's more of the party-liners who take the myopic view, regardless of being liberal or conservative.
Gregs300CD is offline  
post #45 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 04:39 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
mcbear's Avatar
 
Date registered: Apr 2004
Vehicle: E500Es
Location: The BlueGrass State
Posts: 29,579
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teutone
The attitude in Washington seems to be, :"In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is King."
The Great American One-Eyed White Snake?

McBear,
Kentucky

Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
mcbear is offline  
post #46 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 04:53 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
mcbear's Avatar
 
Date registered: Apr 2004
Vehicle: E500Es
Location: The BlueGrass State
Posts: 29,579
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by QBNCGAR
I'd disagree (of course) - DBP cast a blanket big enough to cover half of America, essentially drawing a parallel between ALL Republicans and these a$$hole televangelists. As a republican, that, to me, is pretty much an attack.

I detest the religious right, and yet I am a conservative. I can't vote democrat, as it seems that party is intent on aligning itself with the far left rather than the mainstream. I consider it a fact that in practice, liberalism (especially in the form of 'compassionate' social policies), despite it's best intentions, ends up doing more harm than good.

Therefore I vote Republican. DBP blasted all of them, effectively saying we're all either sheisters or "morons from Kansas". There's no basis for that statement - it's just spewing BS at the mouth, which is the hallmark of liberal democrats. How is that not an attack? Why should anyone have to suffer that?

I'll certainly take responsibility for my actions - I think it frankly ridiculous to claim that conservatives are the ones with an aversion to taking responsibility for their own actions. There's not enough time in my day to start citing the examples of this with liberals, but certainly Roe v. Wade leaps immediately to mind. If you consider it 'unfair' or an 'attack' to infer that liberals are in support of laws allowing unfettered access to a womb for the purpose of murdering an unborn human beings in the name of personal convenience, then you know how it feels to be labeled an idiot/snake-oil salesman just because I don't happen to agree.
You have to admit that in the great Republican Chorus that has been singing for the past five years, most of the rhetoric has come from the fringe right, and from the very vocal ultra conservative base. The traditional conservative base, which has in the past practiced fiscal conservatism and pro US business has all but disappeared and been replaced by a Global business supporter which has sold medium sized business out to NAFTA and China and opened the door to further inroads with CAFTA. Also, the traditional base never pushed an agenda of Biblical inerrancy and a foreign policy that pushed that Christian view to the rest of the world.

I don’t think near as many folk would be as vocal against Republicans if the mainstream Republican Party was speaking up and letting its voice be heard instead of allowing the extreme views speak for it.

The Democratic Party has the same problem with the Michael Moore factions and frankly most of the Democrats that I know just ignore him. I put him on the same level as Rush Limbaugh and ignore both sides

McBear,
Kentucky

Being smart is knowing the difference, in a sticky situation between a well delivered anecdote and a well delivered antidote - bear.
mcbear is offline  
post #47 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 06:24 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Elite
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 95 E300
Location: Inside my head
Posts: 36,850
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 392 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
The forgotten founder: John Witherspoon
By Roger Kimball
(http://www.newcriterion.com/archives...n-witherspoon/)

He is as high a Son of Liberty, as any man in America.
—John Adams on John Witherspoon, 1774
Who is the most unfairly neglected American Founding Father? You might think that none can be unfairly neglected, so many books about that distinguished coterie have been published lately. John Adams, Benjamin Franklin, Alexander Hamilton, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, George Washington—whom have I left out? It has been a literary festival of Founders these last few years, and a good thing, too. But there is one figure, I believe, who has yet to get his due, and that is John Witherspoon (1723–1794). This Scotch Presbyterian divine came to America to preside over a distressed college in Princeton, New Jersey, and wound up transmitting to the colonies critical principles of the Scottish Enlightenment and helped to preside over the birth and consolidation of American independence.

Jeffry Morrison’s brief, excellent new book, John Witherspoon and the Founding of the American Republic,[1] both testifies to and partly redresses the neglect Witherspoon has suffered. Modern scholars, Morrison points out, “have not made much out of Witherspoon one way or another.” For example, a standard text called The Forgotten Leaders of the American Revolution (1955) omits Witherspoon entirely. But during his lifetime Witherspoon enjoyed a very high reputation not only as a clergyman but also as a public intellectual and man of affairs. He commanded immense prestige both in his native Scotland and, even more, in America. Benjamin Rush spoke for many when, a few years after Witherspoon died, he eulogized him as “a man of great and luminous mind” and predicted that “his work will probably preserve his name to the end of time.” He radiated what his contemporaries called “presence”: a personal dignity and charisma that transcended ideological differences and commanded respect. The contemporary record is full of encomia and tokens of deference. John Adams was notoriously stingy with praise (Hamilton he called “the bastard son of a Scotch pedlar,” Washington “old mutton-head”), but Witherspoon emerged in his estimation “an animated son of Liberty.” Jefferson was always going on about the “irritable tribe of priests” and castigated Presbyterians as “the loudest most intolerant of sects,” but he was cordiality itself when it came to the great Dr. Witherspoon. The fact that today his work goes unread and the name “Witherspoon” is more broadly associated with his direct descendant, the actress Reese Witherspoon, tells us something about the fragility of fame. No wonder Morrison calls his first chapter “Forgotten Founder.”

In part, Morrison observes, the eclipse of Witherspoon’s reputation was due to such accidents as a fire that destroyed his library and correspondence: having less to work with, posterity tends to work less. But John Witherspoon was a formidable intellectual and political leader whose role in the affairs of colonial and early republican America deserves wider recognition. He was, as one modern scholar puts it, “Quite possibly the most influential religious and educational leader in Revolutionary America.” In the last quarter of the eighteenth century, his imprint was everywhere, from small things to large. It was Witherspoon, for example, who is thought to have introduced the Latin term “campus” to describe the grounds of a college. In one of his essays on language, he coined the term “Americanism.” According to Thomas Miller, who edited an edition of Witherspoon’s selected works in 1990, his Lectures on Eloquence count as the first treatise on rhetoric in America. More to the point, Witherspoon’s Lectures on Moral Philosophy introduced a generation of Princetonians to some leading Enlightenment themes, refracted through the prism of Calvinist anthropology.

Witherspoon was particularly important as a political activist, an advocate for and architect of American independence. As early as 1774, in an essay called “Thoughts on American Liberty,” he wrote that “We are firmly determined never to submit to, and do deliberately prefer war with all its horrors and even extermination itself, to slavery riveted upon us and our posterity.” He was a signer of the Declaration of Independence, the only clergyman among that group of fifty-six. In May 1776, when the colonies teetered on the edge of war with England, he preached a sermon titled “Dominion of Providence over the Passions of Men.” The church historian William Warren Sweet called it “one of the most influential pulpit utterances during the whole course of the war.” Arguing that “There is not a single instance in history, in which civil liberty was lost, and religious liberty preserved entire,” Witherspoon articulated a link between spiritual and temporal liberty in a way that that spoke vividly to the passions of the moment. In July 1776, when the question of succession was hotly debated and one delegate argued that the country was not yet “ripe” for independence, Witherspoon shot back: “In my judgement the country is not only ripe for the measure, but in danger of becoming rotten for the want of it.”

“Energy,” William Blake wrote, “is eternal delight.” Witherspoon was a prodigy of energy. Almost continuously from 1776 to 1782 he was a member of the Continental Congress. He served on over one hundred committees—more, it appears, than anyone else—including the critically important War Board and Committee on Finance. Only when the outcome of the war was certain did he return to his duties at Princeton. A good Scot, Witherspoon was blessed with keen fiscal intelligence. His Essay on Money as a Medium of Commerce, with Remarks on the Advantages and Disadvantages of Paper Admitted into General Circulation (1786) was not only a warning against adulterating the money supply but also an early brief for free market policies. When in 1768 he came to the College of New Jersey (as Princeton was then officially denominated), the young school was so nearly bankrupt that it could only afford to pay part of the travel expenses of its new president. Within two years, Witherspoon had turned the red ink to black, preaching and fund-raising indefatigably from Boston to South Carolina. In 1789, when he was sixty-six, Witherspoon lost his wife of forty-two years. Two years later, much to the consternation of his neighbors in Princeton, he married Anne Dill, a twenty-four-year-old widow, with whom he had two daughters.

Witherspoon transformed Princeton (the college was often called by the name of its town even before its rebaptism) from a creaky clerical institution into a vibrant bastion of Scotch empiricism and Presbyterian fervor. Harvard was older than Princeton, but under Witherspoon the New Jersey school became a political and intellectual powerhouse. In The Political Philosophy of James Madison (2001), Garrett Ward Sheldon describes the daily routine of the college under Witherspoon. The day began at 5 A.M. with the morning bell. At 6 A.M. there were chapel services. The next hour was reserved for study, followed by breakfast. At 9:00 there was recitation, then study until 1:00 P.M., when dinner was served. After the midday meal there was another period of recitation and study. At 5:00 P.M. there were prayers, followed by supper at 7:00 P.M. and bed at 9. “A regimen,” Sheldon wryly remarks, “I’m sure similar to that conducted by Princeton students today.” But it wasn’t so much discipline that dis- tinguished Princeton: it was intellectual sophistication. Witherspoon did not deviate much from Calvinist strictness on social or cultural matters. In 1757, for example, he published Serious Inquiry into the Nature and Effects of the Stage, which effects, as the title suggests, turned out to be bad. But in a larger sense Princeton under Witherspoon was an institution fired by intellectual curiosity and seriousness.

It was also an institution fired by a commitment to freedom of conscience. While Virginia debated whether Anglicanism should be recognized as the only established state religion (Witherspoon was vociferously against it), Presbyterians and Congregationalists argued for religious freedom. As Jack Scott, the editor of a modern edition of Witherspoon’s Lectures on Moral Philosophy, noted, what began as a theological debate evolved into a “broad-gauged, thoroughly secular protest movement.” The role of Witherspoon and his brand of Presbyterian Calvinism in that protest movement cannot be overstated. When the Revolutionary War finally broke out, many—even George III—called it “The Presbyterian Rebellion.” Ambrose Serle, a British clerk who accompanied the British army from 1776–1778, observed that “Presbyterianism is really at the Bottom of the whole Conspiracy.” He wasn’t wrong.

MORE
Botnst is offline  
post #48 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 07:12 PM
BenzWorld Senior Member
 
Date registered: Sep 2003
Vehicle: 300d, 409d
Location: Denver, CO USA
Posts: 440
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I think the issue with the original piece that is unaddressed is 'What is Evangelicalism'. The author interprets it as a kind of countercultural theological movement and then finds his disagreement with the religious right in their lack of committment to their theology. Another way of looking at evangelicalism would be to see it as primarily a group defined not by theology but by sets of sociological attitudes with theology as a byproduct of cultural conservatism. Looking at it this way, evangelicalism is not betraying itself but exposing itself as as something other than a theological movement. The people who held similar views to the author's views in the 60's began the magazine 'Post-American' which evolved into Sojourners but they have never been inthe evangelical mainstream.
kerry edwards is offline  
post #49 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 07:18 PM
Administratoris Emeritus
 
GeeS's Avatar
 
Date registered: Aug 2002
Vehicle: 2021 SL770
Location: Fountain Hills, AZ
Posts: 44,915
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Quoted: 591 Post(s)
Hey -- welcome back Kerry -- you were sorely missed.

"If spending money you don't have is the height of stupidity, borrowing money to give it away is the height of insanity." -- anon
GeeS is offline  
post #50 of 101 (permalink) Old 06-27-2006, 07:21 PM
BenzWorld Senior Member
 
Date registered: Sep 2003
Vehicle: 300d, 409d
Location: Denver, CO USA
Posts: 440
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks. Missed everyone too.

Kerry
kerry edwards is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Mercedes-Benz Forum > General Mercedes-Benz Forums > Off-Topic

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Mercedes-Benz Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











  • Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
     
    Thread Tools
    Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
    Email this Page Email this Page
    Display Modes
    Linear Mode Linear Mode



    Posting Rules  
    You may post new threads
    You may post replies
    You may not post attachments
    You may not edit your posts

    BB code is On
    Smilies are On
    [IMG] code is On
    HTML code is Off
    Trackbacks are On
    Pingbacks are On
    Refbacks are On

     

    Title goes here

    close
    video goes here
    description goes here. Read Full Story
    For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome