Will there be a regime change in 2008? - Page 10 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #91 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 05:25 AM
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

I suppose that depends on some of the details, but leaking classified information like a CIA operatives name in a time of war sounds pretty serious to me. Of course the DISCO dude at the time might have been trying to instill fear instead of loyalty to the United States at the time.

By the way, if the wiretaps, which were done repeatedly, and the case is based on perceived power to circumvent FISA's provisions for using a special, secret court and all granted in the same document the Bush regime stepped all over when they invaded Iraq, are found to be illegal, I really don't see much wiggle room. Impeachment, well deserved impeachment, is really cut and dried. Therefore the pressure to make wiggle room on the front end determination of legality. Jim
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post #92 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 10:02 AM
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

Quote:
JimSmith - 2/12/2006 7:25 AM

I suppose that depends on some of the details, but leaking classified information like a CIA operatives name in a time of war sounds pretty serious to me. Of course the DISCO dude at the time might have been trying to instill fear instead of loyalty to the United States at the time.

By the way, if the wiretaps, which were done repeatedly, and the case is based on perceived power to circumvent FISA's provisions for using a special, secret court and all granted in the same document the Bush regime stepped all over when they invaded Iraq, are found to be illegal, I really don't see much wiggle room. Impeachment, well deserved impeachment, is really cut and dried. Therefore the pressure to make wiggle room on the front end determination of legality. Jim
Have charges been brought against anybody in the eavesdropping imbroglio?
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post #93 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 10:21 AM
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

One of the main issues for the midterm elections this year will be this impeachment issue. You can be sure that if the dems cain control of either the House or the Senate, they will bring the charges.

The issue, as I see it framed by the administration is not related to FISA courts. It is an Atricle 2 issue--the ongoing struugle between the legislative and the executive branches.
Does Congree have the legal ability to pass a law ( other than a Constitutional Amendment) that takes away Constitutionally-defined Powers of the President?
I really wish the dems could offer something more than " I hate Bush" and "We're not like them" I hear there is an underground revolt brewing among some of the younger dems to repudiate the current leadership of Pelossi, Kennedy, et al.. It will be interesting to watch.
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post #94 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 11:06 AM
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

Quote:
MS Fowler - 2/12/2006 12:21 PM

...
Does Congree have the legal ability to pass a law ( other than a Constitutional Amendment) that takes away Constitutionally-defined Powers of the President?
...
Some lawyer out there correct me if I get this wrong, but I believe that Gonzales asserted that in the event this issue were to come before the Supreme Court that the court would not rule on which branch had the authority on a question asserting powers between Articles 1&2.

Rather, they would look for a lesser argument that would not serve to create a new boundary around either branch of Gov. Gonzales then claimed that the Executive Branch's authority to conduct eavesdropping came not only from Constitutional powers but also from a specific law passed by Congress, FISA. he asserted that FISA itself makes exceptions to the requirement for a warrant, even a posteriori warrants and that they acted under that section of FISA.

None of the senators argued with that assertion.

Bot
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post #95 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 11:44 AM
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

Quote:
JimSmith - 2/12/2006 7:25 AM

I suppose that depends on some of the details, but leaking classified information like a CIA operatives name in a time of war sounds pretty serious to me. Of course the DISCO dude at the time might have been trying to instill fear instead of loyalty to the United States at the time.

By the way, if the wiretaps, which were done repeatedly, and the case is based on perceived power to circumvent FISA's provisions for using a special, secret court and all granted in the same document the Bush regime stepped all over when they invaded Iraq, are found to be illegal, I really don't see much wiggle room. Impeachment, well deserved impeachment, is really cut and dried. Therefore the pressure to make wiggle room on the front end determination of legality. Jim



You keep talking about treason. Again put up or shut up. You still haven't cited anything remotely treasonable. And you haven't shown anything that rises to impeachment level.
Did you know that the Clinton administration asserted the President has the power you're now calling a crime. Though I disagree with the wiretapping it's merely a question of the other two branches putting limits on it, not bringing charges and jailing people.




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post #96 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 12:08 PM
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

Maybe W could've just stole some classified info, that would just be a fine.
post #97 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 12:42 PM
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

Inquiry Into Wiretapping Article Widens
Jason Reed/ReutersDirector of National Intelligence John Negroponte, left, spoke this month at a Senate hearing on threats to the United States. With him were C.I.A. Director Porter J. Goss and F.B.I. Director Robert S. Mueller III.
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By DAVID JOHNSTON
Published: February 12, 2006
WASHINGTON, Feb. 11 — Federal agents have interviewed officials at several of the country's law enforcement and national security agencies in a rapidly expanding criminal investigation into the circumstances surrounding a New York Times article published in December that disclosed the existence of a highly classified domestic eavesdropping program, according to government officials.

The investigation, which appears to cover the case from 2004, when the newspaper began reporting the story, is being closely coordinated with criminal prosecutors at the Justice Department, the officials said. People who have been interviewed and others in the government who have been briefed on the interviews said the investigation seemed to lay the groundwork for a grand jury inquiry that could lead to criminal charges.

The inquiry is progressing as a debate about the eavesdropping rages in Congress and elsewhere. President Bush has condemned the leak as a "shameful act." Others, like Porter J. Goss, the C.I.A. director, have expressed the hope that reporters will be summoned before a grand jury and asked to reveal the identities of those who provided them classified information.

Mr. Goss, speaking at a Senate intelligence committee hearing on Feb. 2, said: "It is my aim and it is my hope that we will witness a grand jury investigation with reporters present being asked to reveal who is leaking this information. I believe the safety of this nation and the people of this country deserve nothing less."

The case is viewed as potentially far reaching because it places on a collision course constitutional principles that each side regards as paramount. For the government, the investigation represents an effort to punish those responsible for a serious security breach and enforce legal sanctions against leaks of classified information at a time of heightened terrorist threats. For news organizations, the inquiry threatens the confidentiality of sources and the ability to report on controversial national security issues free of government interference.

Redundantly more at NY Times
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post #98 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 12:56 PM Thread Starter
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

And Condi Rice says today that the world should not make cartoons that might be offensive to some, that gov'ts should take action to stifle the possibly offensive material.

How much freedom of speech does this executive branch want to take away in the name of patriotism? Do they even recognize what they are doing?
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post #99 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 01:03 PM
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

Quote:
Shane - 2/12/2006 2:56 PM

And Condi Rice says today that the world should not make cartoons that might be offensive to some, that gov'ts should take action to stifle the possibly offensive material.

How much freedom of speech does this executive branch want to take away in the name of patriotism? Do they even recognize what they are doing?
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post #100 of 147 (permalink) Old 02-12-2006, 01:08 PM Thread Starter
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RE: Will there be a regime change in 2008?

So Twue!!!!
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