A Muslim's point of view... - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #11 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:12 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Shabah's Avatar
 
Date registered: Nov 2004
Vehicle: 300c (1956)
Location: 19 05'40.0 N, 49 49'09 E
Posts: 2,773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
Jillian80 - 2/6/2006 8:01 PM

Quote:
Tahloube - 2/6/2006 6:55 PM


Basically because Muslims have great love and respect for their icons (including Jesus, peace be upon him) and dishonouring them publically is unacceptable. It's "haram = forbidden".
If these Muslims had so much 'love and respect' for their icons, they'd certainly realize that torching buildings and threatening harm to innocent people goes against everything these icons taught. Seems like they've missed the message, big style.
Jillian, Tahloube expressed her view on that too. It was not right to burn the embassies. I would have opted for trade sanctions. As we speak there were overe $180 million in trade losses and it's climbing.
Shabah is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #12 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:12 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Elite
 
Tahloube's Avatar
 
Date registered: Aug 2005
Vehicle: 1990 500 SEL, 2003 Range Rover HSE
Location: Abu Dhabi, UAE
Posts: 2,073
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
Kajtek1 - 2/7/2006 3:58 AM

Quote:
BackRoll23 - 2/6/2006 4:34 PM

Now why is it that when someone says something bad about Christians that they don't go and riot or blow something up?
OH REALLY?
http://www.medievalcrusades.com/

Valid points Tahloube, but there never suppose to be excuse for violence, especially against innocent people.
I met some Armenian people, that had to flee the Arabic World, because of their religion, so each system, or belive has its "dark side".
I still think we should not judge whole religion on the base of some extremes.


I know a couple of Armenian families very well; they've been our neighbours for some time. The "dark side" of Islam is always a misunderstanding, a big misunderstanding. I believe in Islam in its most pure form, the one understood and practiced by Prophet Muhammed, peace be upon him, and his companions. Please take a look at this article on religious tolerance:
http://english.islamway.com/bindex.php?section=article&id=137



Tahloube is offline  
post #13 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:17 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Jillian80's Avatar
 
Date registered: Dec 2004
Vehicle: DeLorean DMC-12
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 5,180
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
Shabah - 2/6/2006 7:12 PM

Quote:
Jillian80 - 2/6/2006 8:01 PM

Quote:
Tahloube - 2/6/2006 6:55 PM


Basically because Muslims have great love and respect for their icons (including Jesus, peace be upon him) and dishonouring them publically is unacceptable. It's "haram = forbidden".
If these Muslims had so much 'love and respect' for their icons, they'd certainly realize that torching buildings and threatening harm to innocent people goes against everything these icons taught. Seems like they've missed the message, big style.
Jillian, Tahloube expressed her view on that too. It was not right to burn the embassies. I would have opted for trade sanctions. As we speak there were overe $180 million in trade losses and it's climbing.
I saw that, Shabah. And, I agree on the trade sanctions. Money talks.

I was merely commenting that turning to violence because your icons were publically humiliated goes against everything these guys were teaching.

Good to see you back. [:)]
Jillian80 is offline  
post #14 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:19 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Shabah's Avatar
 
Date registered: Nov 2004
Vehicle: 300c (1956)
Location: 19 05'40.0 N, 49 49'09 E
Posts: 2,773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Here is an article written by Rahul Mahajan (He is not Muslim, just in case you wondered):
Quote:
Weekly Commentary -- The Danish Cartoons
Last September, a Danish newspaper, Jyllands Posten, ran twelve cartoons depicting the Muslim prophet Muhammad; today, everyone is talking about it.

The cartoons range from unclear or neutral to increasingly scurrilous. The worst depicts the prophet with a bomb in his turban, and the Muslim creed, “Allahu akbar,� “God is great,� written on it.

Muslims responded with outrage and calls for a boycott of Danish goods, for the Danish government to apologize or to act against the newspaper, for the U.N. to sanction Denmark in some way.

Supposedly as a lesson to Muslims about freedom of speech, papers in Norway, France, Germany, Italy, Spain, and other European countries reprinted the cartoons – as has the Philadelphia Inquirer in the United States. Papers in Jordan ran them as well.

The Muslim response has escalated, with calls from some groups for violence, the burning of embassy buildings in Syria, and finally the burning of the Danish consulate in Beirut.

Everyone is talking about it, but some key things are being left unsaid.

First, the cartoons are not just blasphemous. Blasphemy, to me, is an internal matter for any religion and not the business of the state or the polity as a whole. Here, however, the portrayal of the prophet as a terrorist was not primarily a statement about him and his life but a claim that Muslims are essentially terrorists.

As such, it is deeply racist. Except that racist is not the right term, because Muslim aren’t a race. We need new categories.

In theory, attacking members of a religion is different from attacking members of a race because you can choose your religious beliefs but not your race. In practice, there is often little difference. The vast majority of people are born to their religion; they don’t choose it. And in the context of a “war for civilization� where Muslims are being essentialized, uniformized, and criticized on a constant basis, the distinction blurs almost into nothingness.

It is not simply a matter of the cartoons’ being offensive to Muslims. They are offensive to everyone who is anti-racist, and we all have an interest in opposing them. This does not mean keeping criticism of Islam and even of the prophet out of the public sphere, but this depiction crosses the line into a universally discredited discrimination. A newspaper has the right to publish even this, just as it has the right to publish offensive depictions of African-Americans, but it should be opposed when it does.

Also left unsaid in the various pious finger-wagging lectures about free speech so graciously delivered to Muslims by newspapers in Christian countries is an extreme double standard. It is true that Christian countries have seen art works like Andres Serrano’s depiction of a crucifix in urine without erupting into violent conflagrations (although there was a great deal of protest by Christians), but those were works by individual artists. Please, show me the American or European mainstream daily newspaper that would publish something so defamatory about Jesus. Has the Inquirer or any other paper run a cartoon depicting Jesus sodomizing stacked naked inmates at Abu Ghraib or even Jesus yelling “Yee-hah� as he drops a bomb on Fallujah (much as George Bush might be doing today had he stuck it out with the Texas Air National Guard)? Until they do, all this talk about free speech is the sheerest hypocrisy.

The response from the Muslim world has been excessive. Of course, boycotting Danish goods is their right – our wonderful economic system is based on freedom of transaction – although it makes little sense to target all of Denmark instead of the paper in question. Calls for a government apology or for government action against the newspaper betray an unhealthy lack of appreciation for independence of the press. And, of course, burning down buildings and calls to kill people are unacceptable, as numerous Muslim leaders, including one of the key organizers of the march in Beirut that led to the burning of the consulate, have stated quite clearly.

But let’s get a grip here. One person may have died in Beirut; reports conflict. But so far nobody else has been killed in this campaign that has aroused so much opprobrium. All of the Sturm und Drang doesn’t compare to one day in occupied Palestine, let alone to the violent invasion and occupation of two countries, killing tens of thousands directly and leading, in Iraq, to the death, direct and iof over 150,000 people.

It is a little too much to see the perpetrators or supporters of those atrocities lecturing the victims about overreaction.

The great crusade and culture war the Bush administration has set in motion since 9/11 has had many unfortunate effects. One of the worst for the Middle East, other than direct occupation and destruction like in Iraq, may be the hardening of increasingly strict religious interpretations. That will harm the people there far more than those in Europe or the United States, but it also increases an already extreme polarization that is harmful for everyone. Bombing Muslims while simultaneously lecturing them is not the way to defuse this dynamic. That really ought to be obvious.
He put it very well by explaining the canotation of such cartoons. They were not simply expressing some artistic form of free expression but they were intended to paint all Muslim with a wide brush that they are terrorists.
For the ones who are comparing this to Jesus being put up in cartoons prior to this, again, these were never drawn by Muslims as they revere Jesus as well. As matter of fact real Islamic art avoids drawing people and when you think about it, that is why they excelled in caligraphy because it was the only permissible form of artistic expression next to architecture.
Shabah is offline  
post #15 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:19 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Elite
 
Tahloube's Avatar
 
Date registered: Aug 2005
Vehicle: 1990 500 SEL, 2003 Range Rover HSE
Location: Abu Dhabi, UAE
Posts: 2,073
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
gregs210 - 2/7/2006 3:59 AM

Quote:
Basically because Muslims have great love and respect for their icons (including Jesus, peace be upon him) and dishonouring them publically is unacceptable. It's "haram = forbidden".

It's a shame that these cartoons exist. But that doesn't mean blowing up something is OK. It's just not right. It's haram. If some Muslims did it, that doesn't mean it's acceptable. Maybe some people got carried away just like sports fans who do works of vandalism after a match or something. But that's no excuse.
True, but the analogy breaks down beause when sports fans do it you know it's because they're just over the top fools (and probably intoxicated), whereas the fanatical Muslims do it in the name of and for the sake of their religion.

Oh, come on. Fanatical Muslims no longer exist in Syria. They have been wiped out a couple of centuries ago. Assad was bragging about that right after 9/11 and wanted Ameicans to do the same.
Tahloube is offline  
post #16 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:20 PM
~BANNED~
 
deathrattle's Avatar
 
Date registered: Jan 2005
Vehicle: 1992 W126 300 SE
Location: Head in the clouds
Posts: 11,045
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
Kajtek1 - 2/7/2006 12:58 AM

Quote:
BackRoll23 - 2/6/2006 4:34 PM

Now why is it that when someone says something bad about Christians that they don't go and riot or blow something up?
OH REALLY?
http://www.medievalcrusades.com/

Valid points Tahloube, but there never suppose to be excuse for violence, especially against innocent people.
I met some Armenian people, that had to flee the Arabic World, because of their religion, so each system, or belive has its "dark side".
I still think we should not judge whole religion on the base of some extremes.
The world would be a better place if there were no religions at all to have to judge,tolerate or suffer from.In light of the progress of scientific discovery mankind has achieved since the enlightenment,it is pitiful that we even have to accomodate medieval faith based ideologies in our societies today.



deathrattle is offline  
post #17 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:20 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Elite
 
Tahloube's Avatar
 
Date registered: Aug 2005
Vehicle: 1990 500 SEL, 2003 Range Rover HSE
Location: Abu Dhabi, UAE
Posts: 2,073
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
Jillian80 - 2/7/2006 4:01 AM

Quote:
Tahloube - 2/6/2006 6:55 PM


Basically because Muslims have great love and respect for their icons (including Jesus, peace be upon him) and dishonouring them publically is unacceptable. It's "haram = forbidden".
If these Muslims had so much 'love and respect' for their icons, they'd certainly realize that torching buildings and threatening harm to innocent people goes against everything these icons taught. Seems like they've missed the message, big style.

You're absolutely right.
Tahloube is offline  
post #18 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:22 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Shabah's Avatar
 
Date registered: Nov 2004
Vehicle: 300c (1956)
Location: 19 05'40.0 N, 49 49'09 E
Posts: 2,773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
Jillian80 - 2/6/2006 8:17 PM

Quote:
Shabah - 2/6/2006 7:12 PM

Quote:
Jillian80 - 2/6/2006 8:01 PM

Quote:
Tahloube - 2/6/2006 6:55 PM


Basically because Muslims have great love and respect for their icons (including Jesus, peace be upon him) and dishonouring them publically is unacceptable. It's "haram = forbidden".
If these Muslims had so much 'love and respect' for their icons, they'd certainly realize that torching buildings and threatening harm to innocent people goes against everything these icons taught. Seems like they've missed the message, big style.
Jillian, Tahloube expressed her view on that too. It was not right to burn the embassies. I would have opted for trade sanctions. As we speak there were overe $180 million in trade losses and it's climbing.
I saw that, Shabah. And, I agree on the trade sanctions. Money talks.

I was merely commenting that turning to violence because your icons were publically humiliated goes against everything these guys were teaching.

Good to see you back. [:)]
Oh no Jillian, idol worshiping was the issue when people's faces are drawn so they can be rememberd and with an injection of ignorance end up being revered. The Prophet never wanted the Muslim to revere him but rather focus on his teachings. The only one to revere is God.
Shabah is offline  
post #19 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:23 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Elite
 
Tahloube's Avatar
 
Date registered: Aug 2005
Vehicle: 1990 500 SEL, 2003 Range Rover HSE
Location: Abu Dhabi, UAE
Posts: 2,073
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
(Thread Starter)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
Jillian80 - 2/7/2006 4:07 AM

Quote:
Tahloube - 2/6/2006 7:04 PM

An apology from the news paper would have solved the problem for me. A promise not to do it again would be even better.
A promise not to do it again??? Why should they do that? If you find it offensive, don't look. Simple as that.

If I offend someone by mistake, I'll apologise and promise never ever to do it again. I'll be extra nice to compensate. Unless the offence was deliberate
Tahloube is offline  
post #20 of 296 (permalink) Old 02-06-2006, 06:25 PM
BenzWorld Extremist
 
Andrew2004az's Avatar
 
Date registered: Feb 2004
Vehicle: 02 ML 320
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,046
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: A Muslim's point of view...

Quote:
Tahloube - 2/6/2006 8:04 PM

Quote:
Roch207 - 2/7/2006 3:53 AM

I can understand protesting the individual newspapers, but to say it is the governments responsibility is a little over the top. The Chilean embassy and Austrian embassies did not need to be torched. Boycott the papers.

That's right. But in the third world, we attribute responsibility for governmets because that's the way it is in our own countries. An apology from the news paper would have solved the problem for me. A promise not to do it again would be even better.
Why dont you guys come over and apologize to me everytime i have to get on an airplane... and for wasting more tax dollars to fix your peaceful religion. I know why there are so many raticals in the islamic world it is due to the lack of education and literacy to read the text and followers rely on leaders who have skewed views to teach them. But again i can see how one sided you guys think about how your the only thing in the world that matters. Mocking each other is in everyday life from TV shows that mock the stereotypical jew/christian and we just lol and dont take it personally but ow no lets not make fun of a muslim they are the only people who have feelings...

Well thats an American Christian Republicans point of view^^^^ so i hope you can understand where we come from and respect us more and maybe try and follow one thing in your religion teach compassion and understanding and teach others to treat how they want to be treated.
Andrew2004az is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Mercedes-Benz Forum > General Mercedes-Benz Forums > Off-Topic

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Mercedes-Benz Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











  • Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
     
    Thread Tools
    Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
    Email this Page Email this Page
    Display Modes
    Linear Mode Linear Mode



    Posting Rules  
    You may post new threads
    You may post replies
    You may not post attachments
    You may not edit your posts

    BB code is On
    Smilies are On
    [IMG] code is On
    HTML code is Off
    Trackbacks are On
    Pingbacks are On
    Refbacks are On

     

    Title goes here

    close
    video goes here
    description goes here. Read Full Story
    For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome