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post #21 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-04-2005, 05:03 PM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

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Shane - 5/3/2005 7:01 PM

WWIII will be over economics and not military might.
Every war in modern history was over economics.
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post #22 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-04-2005, 05:44 PM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

I haven't seen the documentary, but it sounds like it's worth watching. From what I understand Japan was prepared to continue their fight even after the bombings, and that they decided to surrender to the American's rather than face the Soviets. Having seen the handling of the Germans by both the Soviets and the Americans it seems like a pretty logical decision.

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post #23 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-04-2005, 05:53 PM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

Also, read this week's Newsweek. Great article on China. They are, and have been, the ones to fear. All the crap we buy is funding the Chinnese government. Also, someone mentioned that we're going to be owned by the Japanese, unless you're living in the late 80's, that's no longer a reality. Japan was in and out of recession all through the 90's and still has stagnet growth today. And now Japan is losing market share to Chinese goods globaly as well. China can exude ecnomic pressure on every country, and for that will be a recognized world power, if they aren't already.

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post #24 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-04-2005, 08:09 PM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

Quote:
MetaPhysicalPajamas - 5/4/2005 6:03 PM

Quote:
Shane - 5/3/2005 7:01 PM

WWIII will be over economics and not military might.
Every war in modern history was over economics.
True. And many wars in the past. (Better pastures, more water, deep harbors, etc.) But to shroud a war for oil in the white linen of self righteous, self preservation is deceitful and pathetic.
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post #25 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-04-2005, 09:22 PM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

Quote:
Shane - 5/4/2005 12:25 AM

Quote:
Botnst - 5/3/2005 7:15 PM

WWIII was won while your were sucking mamma's titty. The western alliance defeated the USSR.

We are now engaged in WWIV.

The definition and concept of war change with strategy and technology. Giant mechanized world wars are passe'. Now manipulating us through information management, intimidation of allies or friendly powers, and terrorism are the tools used by our enemies. The DoD is adjusting, huge reluctant beast that it is, to the new weapons, tactics and strategy.

Just thought you'd like to know.
Golly gee and shucks alive! You sure are one of them sharp snappers!

Actually most do not consider the cold war the equaivalent of a world war. That is why it is called the "cold war." The current "war" should not be called a war at all. It should be called a "battle" to stop terrorism. But since when does the complete occupation of a country thwart small terror cells, like Bin Ladin's happy go lucky following? Could better decisions that do not piss off half the world, and ruin a national economy make a difference? Could the powers that be recognize this fact of change and adapt? Apparently not.
Actually most people who read regularly do consider the cold war WWIII.

How does one know or determine when one is at war? Is it reserved for armed conflict between states?

What is the difference between a war and a battle?
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post #26 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-04-2005, 09:50 PM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

Quote:
Shane - 5/4/2005 10:09 PM

Quote:
MetaPhysicalPajamas - 5/4/2005 6:03 PM

Quote:
Shane - 5/3/2005 7:01 PM

WWIII will be over economics and not military might.
Every war in modern history was over economics.
True. And many wars in the past. (Better pastures, more water, deep harbors, etc.) But to shroud a war for oil in the white linen of self righteous, self preservation is deceitful and pathetic.
Yup, but all wars are sold as something other than what they really are. Rally cries, the wealthy have to recruit the masses to do their dirty work for them.

Leadership - getting someone to do something because they want to.
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post #27 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-04-2005, 10:28 PM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

A. Wars are about territory. You got it, I want it.
B. OR wars are about resources: You got it, I want it.
C. OR wars are about culture #1: You got it, I don't want it.
D. OR wars are about culture #2: I got it, you need it.

I think this one is about D from the Al Queda perspective and C from the western point of view. For me personally, I think it's all about B and with a bit of C&D just for spice, a bindaloo war. I figure everybody will have a different mix.
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post #28 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-05-2005, 08:33 AM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

Quote:
GermanStar - 5/4/2005 1:04 PM
Let's try to keep it real here. Pearl Harbor was a military attack against a military target. The attack was an attempt to cripple us militarily to such an extent that we would be unable to forcibly oppose their expansionism in the Far East. In other words, it was a surgical strike aimed at avoiding war.
The attack was definitely a military strike against a military target. They erred in their timing since their ambassadors could not present their declaration of war prior to the attack. So, history records it as a "sneak attack". I don't agree with the "avoiding war" comment. While it was an attempt to cripple the Pacific Fleet, the best they could hope for was to delay the US involvement. There was still an entire fleet in the Atlantic which, in part, could have been sent through the Panama Canal to the Pacific, if it had been needed. To believe that there would be no new military construction would have been naive on Japan's part, if that was their thinking. Also, IMHO, to think that the US would not retaliate after such an attack, even if Japan controlled the Pacific rim, would have been a pipe dream on their part.

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post #29 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-05-2005, 08:38 AM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

My father-in-law, Mrs. Azimuth's father, was in the army serving in Hawaii during the Pearl Harbor attack. His parents and family were interned in a camp at or near topaz mountain in Utah (from what I remember) while he continued to serve in the military during the war. They lost thier land and orchards when it was confiscated and they were moved to the camps.

They later received some compensation but it did not cover thier losses. He's not bitter though. He looks at the overall freedoms and opportunity this country has offered them and writes off the losses as part of the cost.

He's nearly ninety years old now. He still beats me in chess and up 'til two years ago would arm wrestle all comers. He's a Judo king. Sadly, he's too stiff now to tie me in knots anymore. Ten years ago he nearly broke my neck when I bet him he was too old to beat me in a match. I had to tap out to an eighty year old 5'7" tall Japanese grandfather and great-grandfather

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post #30 of 62 (permalink) Old 05-05-2005, 08:40 AM
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RE: Victory Over Japan special on PBS

Quote:
MikeV - 5/4/2005 5:53 PM

Also, read this week's Newsweek. Great article on China. They are, and have been, the ones to fear. All the crap we buy is funding the Chinnese government. Also, someone mentioned that we're going to be owned by the Japanese, unless you're living in the late 80's, that's no longer a reality. Japan was in and out of recession all through the 90's and still has stagnet growth today. And now Japan is losing market share to Chinese goods globaly as well. China can exude ecnomic pressure on every country, and for that will be a recognized world power, if they aren't already.
Maybe you haven't noticed, and Japan has been downplaying their influence, but they OWN the high technology market. Everything hi-tech China builds, they bought the rights and materials from the Japanese. They haven't been exporting their IP or manufacturing base, unlike us, and we are going to be left holding the bag.

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