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post #41 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 08:01 AM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

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Zeitgeist - 3/18/2005 10:46 PM

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azimuth - 3/18/2005 5:38 PM
I think my problem is not so much the sex acts required for gay sex as much as (from what I've read) that actively gay men tend to be more promiscuous than actively heterosexual folks. That is not to say that heteros are not promiscuous, but they are statisticly more likely to be monogamous per capita.
I'm gonna give you the the benefit doubt and consider your stated opinion as open to further contemplation (unlike some of our less intellectualy curious members).

So, lets contemplate social norms and their impact on social behavior. When I was young and single, I engaged in promiscuous sexual behavior, but I always knew that if "Miss Right" came along, I'd focus upon monogamizing my sexual activities. I had biological urges to spread the seed, but social norming pressures to find only one vessel with which to fill regularly. Do you think homosexuals have any such social norms or pressures? Actually, for the most part, they're off the radar of most social norming institutions, so they exist in a sub-culture that recoginizes itself as being deviant from the norm, therefore not subject to norming behaviors and influences.

I submit that if homosexual lifestyles and unions are accepted as normal behavior for a subset of the population (like left-handedness and double jointedness), they would tend towards the social norms of monogamy rather than promiscuousness. My sociological hypothesis may ultimately be proven wrong, but I'd be willing to wager good money that I'm right.
I would suggest that anyone who thinks gays are more promiscous then straights spend the day watching Jerry Springer re-runs.




Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

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post #42 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 08:03 AM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

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LK ONE - 3/19/2005 1:32 AM

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79-300SD - 3/17/2005 11:02 AM

In a latest move of the lunatic left to be fair to those who really love animals California decides to make it legal to marry an animal to eliminate the stigma Beastiality carried with it.

The reasonis is hell, if fags can marry why not a woman and her dog or horse.....or a guy and his sheep.
And I thought the reason they legalized beastiality was so that your parents could finally get married.

Ignorance is a function of stupidity. How fucking dumb do you want to be?
Exactly the point I am trying to make. He constantly refers to women and donkeys having sex in Mexico, and I can only conclude he is a "love child".




Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #43 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 08:04 AM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

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LK ONE - 3/19/2005 1:45 AM

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azimuth - 3/19/2005 1:10 AM

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Zeitgeist - 3/19/2005 12:19 AM

While "society" does require replication to a degree, we currently are experiencing a multitude of negative consequences stemming from population expansion, mostly regarding the use and over-utilization of natural resources. Might not homosexuality, in light of these contemporary realities, actually act as a natural biological brake on such population overload? If you accept those premises, then wouldn't the inclusion of homosexual unions into social norms, actually be a benefit to society?
Good points. We are expiriencing a multitude of negative consequences. I would submit that they are more accurately assigned to poor behavior and poor management of resources.

Homosexuality would operate as a brake. I believe that a little better planning and some self control would solve the problems you see.

I think the disolution of the two parent, male/female, family is the single most destructive force in society today... That said, anything that drives against that family is unwise
Hey Guy,
Figured I'd jump into this discussion because it's interesting. I appreciate you viewing this with an open mind despite your clearly stated opposition to gay marriage.

Just for the sake of argument let assume your statement is correct "I think the disolution of the two parent, male/female, family is the single most destructive force in society today..."
If you truly believe that why aren't you advocating a constitutional amendment to ban divorce? Isn't disolution exactly was divorce is?
How does encouraging marriage threaten your marriage? Interesting fact, and I'm not claiming any scientific link, but do you know that the only state in the Union (good ole Mass.) that allows gay marriage also has the lowest divorce rate in the whole country?If God is trying to make a point that gay marriage threatens heterosexual marriage He sure is picking a funny way to prove it.
What the hell was He thinking when He commanded Pat Robertson to seek the presidency then let his ass get kicked in his first primary?
And another thing....................
If the dissolution of marriage is a great concern of his, perhaps his wrath should be directed at young, Christian women who live in the "Bible Belt". They have the highest rates of divorce in the country.



Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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post #44 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 09:22 AM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

Kirk,
You bring up a good point. Why do the true religious zealots always focus on banning behavior that doesn't require THEM to change anything about themselves?


The Constitution is pretty specific about religion staying the hell out of public life. Why are certain groups calling on it to outlaw behavior they don't like when they are ignoring laws already set in place by it?
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post #45 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 01:02 PM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

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LK ONE - 3/19/2005 11:22 AM
Why do the true religious zealots always focus on banning behavior that doesn't require THEM to change anything about themselves?
It's the pious belief that they are the living incarnation of their deity's will and the evangelical tradition of conformity being the end all, be all. In the end analysis . . . there can only be one true way, and you're either with them or against them. Sound familiar?
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post #46 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 01:22 PM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

if promiscuity is the yardstick then we should all want our daughters to be lesbians. Lesbians are the most monogomous and have the fewest reported sex partners of any "group" gay men do have more sexual partners than straight men.

Forum killa


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post #47 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 05:12 PM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

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Zeitgeist - 3/19/2005 12:19 AM

While "society" does require replication to a degree, we currently are experiencing a multitude of negative consequences stemming from population expansion, mostly regarding the use and over-utilization of natural resources. Might not homosexuality, in light of these contemporary realities, actually act as a natural biological brake on such population overload? If you accept those premises, then wouldn't the inclusion of homosexual unions into social norms, actually be a benefit to society?
Interesting concept, but why does the biological brake seem to be focussed on the populations that already have declining birth rates and relatively high standards of living? If it was a true self regulating effect on population in response to stress on the environment supporting the population, why would it not regulate based on available food supply or some other relationship between resources and restricted access to them arising from generally lower standards of living?

While this "regulation" role may seem logical on the surface it also seems to equate homosexuality to The Plague, which is not really what I expected as your point. Jim
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post #48 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 05:43 PM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

As uncomfortable as that may be to consider, I do wonder if homosexuality is a "natural" mutation within our DNA that serves the biological function of supressing birthrates. If I were homosexual, it would feel strange to consider myself to be a mutation akin to say cancer or the like (and I don't intend that to be a pejorative), but it does make a certain amount of sense.

This line of thought also gets ethically interesting if you consider the current efforts to create gene therapies to reduce the risks from cancer et al...couldn't homosexuality also be encouraged, or not? I should note that I'm way out of my league here, but this stuff does intrigue my meager intellect.
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post #49 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 06:12 PM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

It is an interesting line of thought. I find the incidence of homosexuality being directly related to the standard of living (the higher the standard of living, the higher the incidence of homosexuality) instead of the opposite peculiar, except that nearly every other pattern of activity relating to lowering birth rates seems to also be directly related to the standard of living. Heterosexual couples living "the good life" seem to be settling down later, getting married later, having kids later, and therefore fewer kids. More couples elect not to have any kids.

I lump the homosexual behaviour with the other birth rate reducing behaviours, and conclude that as we strive for our version of the "good life" where no one has to physically struggle to survive anymore, Mother Nature is telling us we are on the wrong path. Low birth rates are a sure path to extinction, and it seems Mother Nature is ok with us limiting our time in the driver's seat. Jim
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post #50 of 64 (permalink) Old 03-19-2005, 06:18 PM
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RE: California legalizes Interspiecies Marriage

There is actually a scientific theory like that, a similiar hypotheses, that homosexuality may be a natural reaction to over-crowding. Now mind, you, this is just theory - one of the parents, it is not known which, must pass some kind of hormonal signal to the off-spring to prevent it from producing children, a hormonal message intended to stop some children in the family group so others can continue breeding, and also in providing an alternate, non breedable mate to otherwise heterosexual males.

Violence against homosexuals may also be deep in the psyche - after all, they are consuming food resources that the breeders might need. The entire theory is well observed in animal studies, especially in rats. If this is the case, then it is perfectly natural, like higher class white women developing larger and larger breasts in America.


Recall that earlier generations faced down fascism and communism not just with missiles and tanks, but with sturdy alliances and enduring convictions. They understood that our power alone cannot protect us, nor does it entitle us to do as we please. Instead, they knew that our power grows through its prudent use; our security emanates from the justness of our cause, the force of our example, the tempering qualities of humility and restraint.

-President Barack Obama, 1st Inaugural address
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