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post #11 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 12:51 PM
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RE: What is fair compensation?

Quote:
kuan1 - 1/25/2005 2:27 PM

You should check out www.thechampion.org

You can search for every teacher's salary in Illinois.

Check this out for example:

Name: Schwarz Christopher
Salary: 84861
Time: F
Months: 10 months
Percent: 100%
Position: Teacher
Experience: 10 years
Assignment: History
Role: High School Teacher
Degree: Master's
Certification: High School (6-12)
Grade(s): 9 to 12
District: Niles Twp Comm High Sch Dist 219
84k for working 9 months a year? Not bad.

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post #12 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 01:23 PM
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RE: What is fair compensation?

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kvining - 1/25/2005 1:51 PM
84k for working 9 months a year? Not bad.
10 years experience though with a Master's.

It was pure coincidence Ron. Really.

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post #13 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 07:46 PM
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RE: What is fair compensation?

Quote:
kuan1 - 1/25/2005 1:27 PM

You should check out www.thechampion.org

You can search for every teacher's salary in Illinois.

Check this out for example:

Name: Schwarz Christopher
Salary: 84861
Time: F
Months: 10 months
Percent: 100%
Position: Teacher
Experience: 10 years
Assignment: History
Role: High School Teacher
Degree: Master's
Certification: High School (6-12)
Grade(s): 9 to 12
District: Niles Twp Comm High Sch Dist 219
Wow,

That is more than IT managers in my area.

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post #14 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 08:39 PM
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RE: What is fair compensation?

Quote:
tiggerfink - 1/25/2005 7:46 PM

Wow,

That is more than IT managers in my area.
It sounds like you value IT managers more than school teachers.

Not sure about in the US, but in most parts of Canada, all school teachers require a minimum of five years of university, and often more. The investment is substantial. Most university graduates 10-15 years out earn a pretty decent living. Teachers in our city earn a decent living, but there is little upside potential. A typical civil engineer easily earns the $70K that a teacher maxes out at, but can earn a great deal more. Teachers here cannot.

It's tough to compare apples to oranges. A grader driver can make $90K with overtime. For grade 12 education and little training, that's pretty good. No tuition or book costs, no 5+ years of no earnings, etc.

Also, most every teacher I know works the same number of hours in a calander year as most semi-professional people. Also, in management, I had eight weeks paid vacation, so that is not an unusual benefit. Our teacher's pension plan is horrible and the health and other benefits are poor compared to many orthe professions.

Make the pay high enough to attract excellent people, but we must keep public funds under control too. We also need to turn around the public perception that teaching is a vocation for the lazy. It's an important job that we have taken for granted for too long. For many decades we had a good supply of teachers and nurses thanks to numbers of bright and capable young women that had no other career options. That has changed.

I'm really trying to see things from your perspective, but I'm having trouble getting my head up my ass
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post #15 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 10:13 PM
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RE: What is fair compensation?

Quote:
MRTIKKET - 1/25/2005 1:54 AM

After seeing our local grade school teachers threaten to strike for higher pay, now our local police and fire depts. are grumbling about needing a pay raise as well.

My question is what is enough? The average wage of our grade school teachers is a shade under $65k per year. Our police average pay is a shade over $50k, and our fire dept. average wage is right at $50k.

The town has no industry at all, a small downtown shopping district, with no chain stores or hotels/motels.

The lowest priced homes are over $400k any new construction is over $1M.

A low property tax bill is $7500 per year. No room for any expansion, other than tearing a structure down.

My thinking is that the pay is fine with no raises necessary The police and fire depts have nearly doubled in size over the last 30 years, though the population has actually declined by a few thousand.

Any thoughts? Am I out of touch monetarily?
do you import these teachers?? 65k salary --> 400k house on the wrong side of the tracks?? same with the rest of service folks...the math is fuzzy there for me... [B)]



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post #16 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 10:33 PM
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RE: What is fair compensation?

If I had to float a house worth $500K with an $8000+ tax bill, no way I'd put up with a class for $65K. Sounds like the poor people in this community are the police, teachers and fire fighters. After work do they head to the food bank?

I'm really trying to see things from your perspective, but I'm having trouble getting my head up my ass
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post #17 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 10:40 PM
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RE: What is fair compensation?

Quote:
blackmercedes - 1/25/2005 9:39 PM

Quote:
tiggerfink - 1/25/2005 7:46 PM

Wow,

That is more than IT managers in my area.
It sounds like you value IT managers more than school teachers.

Not sure about in the US, but in most parts of Canada, all school teachers require a minimum of five years of university, and often more. The investment is substantial. Most university graduates 10-15 years out earn a pretty decent living. Teachers in our city earn a decent living, but there is little upside potential. A typical civil engineer easily earns the $70K that a teacher maxes out at, but can earn a great deal more. Teachers here cannot.

It's tough to compare apples to oranges. A grader driver can make $90K with overtime. For grade 12 education and little training, that's pretty good. No tuition or book costs, no 5+ years of no earnings, etc.

Also, most every teacher I know works the same number of hours in a calander year as most semi-professional people. Also, in management, I had eight weeks paid vacation, so that is not an unusual benefit. Our teacher's pension plan is horrible and the health and other benefits are poor compared to many orthe professions.

Make the pay high enough to attract excellent people, but we must keep public funds under control too. We also need to turn around the public perception that teaching is a vocation for the lazy. It's an important job that we have taken for granted for too long. For many decades we had a good supply of teachers and nurses thanks to numbers of bright and capable young women that had no other career options. That has changed.
I wish I had 8 weeks paid vacation. I do not even have a pension plan. Only government workers get pension plans now days. The most I can get is 3 weeks for being with a company for 5 years. The average civil engineer pay is about 45K in my area. Teachers here go to college for 4 years and have an option of 2 more years to get a master. Teachers also have 3 months off plus other holidays during the school year. If they work the summer school, they get more pay.

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post #18 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 10:51 PM Thread Starter
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RE: What is fair compensation?

LOL! No, the only educators, fire or police who live in the village, live in homes inherited from their folks, or still live with their folks. The homes in the $400 to $500k range are the ones being torn down. I mean if the average new home is a shade over $1 million, who do you think is buying, the local Starbucks barista? If you don't have a cash biz, or a very lucrative business, you don't live here. The real problem is with the lifelong residents who can no longer afford the escalating property taxes. Many reverse mortgages have been taken out.

Ron, your old H.S. district is listed as the next one down from our H.S. district in pay. However the Niles Township H.S. district has loads of industry and a median household income that isn't even a 1/3 of ours. What I was speaking of though, was the elementary school pay. I really don't think a Masters is needed to teach 5th grade Geography. And if the population is a few thousand less than in 1973, please tell me why the police and fire departments have doubled in size.
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post #19 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 10:55 PM Thread Starter
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RE: What is fair compensation?

Another thing, since it is a latchkey mentality, many of the elementary school teachers are employed for cash as after school sitters. Sort of nice for the kids and parents. Teachers bring them home from school and stay til folks get home. Both my sisters do this.
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post #20 of 31 (permalink) Old 01-25-2005, 10:55 PM
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RE: What is fair compensation?

If the teaching profession is so high-paying, has so many crazy perks, and is "the bomb" then why don't the folks complaining become teachers?

I'm really trying to see things from your perspective, but I'm having trouble getting my head up my ass
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