If anyone could be president who would it be? - Page 4 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

View Poll Results: If anyone could be president who would it be?
Ronald Regan 6 26.09%
Barack Obama 8 34.78%
Tenzin Gyatso 1 4.35%
TiggerFink 1 4.35%
Oprah! 5 21.74%
Jesse Ventura - Ain't got time to bleed! 1 4.35%
P E H 1 4.35%
Voters: 23. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #31 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 12:17 PM
BenzWorld Member
 
MikeV's Avatar
 
Date registered: Jan 2004
Vehicle: '04 E55 Tectite
Location: Chino Hills, CA
Posts: 257
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

Please.

You give Clinton an 8 year pass, but blame Bush after 8 months?


If the Patriot Act were in place the plot probably would have been discovered, I'll give you that.


'04 E55 AMG
'04 Yukon Denali
'02 Ram 1500 Quad Cab
'94 928 GTS (SOLD)
MikeV is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 02:09 PM
BenzWorld Senior Member
 
Date registered: Sep 2003
Vehicle: 300d, 409d
Location: Denver, CO USA
Posts: 440
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

For me, the biggest problem in finding a decent candidate is the dirth of democratic social institutions in this country, and the capitalist world in general. The corporate business world and the military have no semblance of democracy in their governing structures or ideology so leaders from those institutions are not socialized to value democracy. Perhaps the best source would have been labor unions, had they maintained any strength (and overlooking Reagan). Churches won't work either because most of them are undemocratic. Ideally, a leader of a large cooperative business enterprise might be good but those are basically non-existent in the US. So, perhaps the best place to find a candidate filled with the spirit of democracy is from very local politics where the voices of individual people are still valued and corporate culture has not yet dominated.
kerry edwards is offline  
post #33 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 03:15 PM
BenzWorld Member
 
MikeV's Avatar
 
Date registered: Jan 2004
Vehicle: '04 E55 Tectite
Location: Chino Hills, CA
Posts: 257
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

Quote:
kerry edwards - 10/28/2004 1:09 PM

For me, the biggest problem in finding a decent candidate is the dirth of democratic social institutions in this country, and the capitalist world in general. The corporate business world and the military have no semblance of democracy in their governing structures or ideology so leaders from those institutions are not socialized to value democracy. Perhaps the best source would have been labor unions, had they maintained any strength (and overlooking Reagan). Churches won't work either because most of them are undemocratic. Ideally, a leader of a large cooperative business enterprise might be good but those are basically non-existent in the US. So, perhaps the best place to find a candidate filled with the spirit of democracy is from very local politics where the voices of individual people are still valued and corporate culture has not yet dominated.
I understand and share some of your frustration. However, I couldn't disagree more with Unions as a possible place to look for leaders. My father was a Teamster for 35+ years, the leadership in Unions is a crooked as a 3 dollar bill and has been since long before Regan. Hoffa? As for leaders of corporations being far from a democracy, I disagree. I think they're very close to representative democracy as you can get. The Board of Directors appoints a CEO, the CEO wants to make Share Holders happy and they intern vote for the board members. It's kind a micro example of our democracy.

Personally I'd rather have somone run for president that's been in the private sector most of his or her life. I think they have a much better understanding for the needs of the country than say someone that's been in elected politics for most of their working life. Had he not turned into a wacko, someone like H Ross Perot would have the prototype for the candidate I would like to see. That's where I think Rudy G is so apealing. Granted, he's been an elected official for large part of his career, but it's been outside of Washington, and in the trenches so to speak.


'04 E55 AMG
'04 Yukon Denali
'02 Ram 1500 Quad Cab
'94 928 GTS (SOLD)
MikeV is offline  
post #34 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 03:48 PM
BenzWorld Senior Member
 
Date registered: Sep 2003
Vehicle: 300d, 409d
Location: Denver, CO USA
Posts: 440
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

No argument about the Teamsters, but to describe a corporation as democractic is beyond the pale. The workers are commodities, have no vote and the sworn obligation of management, CEO and Directors is to the profit of the company and not the democratic rights and well being of its members.
kerry edwards is offline  
post #35 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 03:57 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 95 E300
Location: Inside my head
Posts: 36,850
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 392 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

Quote:
kerry edwards - 10/28/2004 5:48 PM

No argument about the Teamsters, but to describe a corporation as democractic is beyond the pale. The workers are commodities, have no vote and the sworn obligation of management, CEO and Directors is to the profit of the company and not the democratic rights and well being of its members.
More like a meritocratic oligarchy, Not a democracy.

The only example of succesful semi-democratic business is the cooperative model that Z & Kerry mention occasionally.
Botnst is offline  
post #36 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 03:58 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
FeelTheLove's Avatar
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 83 Astral Silver 280 SL
Location: Planet Houston
Posts: 28,829
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

The Teamsters stuff is old news. They have been supervised by the Justice Dept for years. Given the corporate scandals of the last four years, I wouldn't hold corporate America up as some how superior to the Teamsters. Enron stole more in a day than the Teamsters ever did. At least the union members get to hold an election. And being a stockholder, I cannot think of a class of people who has been more royally screwed by crooked corporate management.
FeelTheLove is offline  
post #37 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 04:06 PM
BenzWorld Member
 
MikeV's Avatar
 
Date registered: Jan 2004
Vehicle: '04 E55 Tectite
Location: Chino Hills, CA
Posts: 257
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

This is true all good points. Admitedly I never considered the employees in my example, simply shareholders. Corporate scandle does suck.

But, not all corporate executives are these evil people like so many seem to think.


'04 E55 AMG
'04 Yukon Denali
'02 Ram 1500 Quad Cab
'94 928 GTS (SOLD)
MikeV is offline  
post #38 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 04:18 PM
BenzWorld Elite
 
old300D's Avatar
 
Date registered: Jul 2003
Vehicle: '83 240D
Location: Denver
Posts: 3,774
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

Quote:
MikeV - 10/28/2004 4:06 PM

This is true all good points. Admitedly I never considered the employees in my example, simply shareholders. Corporate scandle does suck.

But, not all corporate executives are these evil people like so many seem to think.
The point wasn't that they were evil.

It's that corporate executives are not practiced in democratic principles; it's just not the nature of corporations to be democratic. People that run corporations may or may not be good at or value the techniques that lend to success as elected government officials.

Colorado's senate race is between Salazar (Colorado state attorney general) and Coors (corporate executive). Coors maintains he can bring leadership to the Senate because of his corporate ability and experience. And that's as specific as he gets. And that's all the original thought he seems to have. All the rest of his positions tow the Bush line. I don't call that "leadership".

You can tell who I voted for. [;)]

OBK #35

old300D is offline  
post #39 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 08:20 PM
BenzWorld Member
 
Date registered: Sep 2004
Vehicle: 1986 300SDL
Location: Boston
Posts: 383
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

Quote:
MikeV - 10/28/2004 1:08 PM

Quote:
kvining - 10/27/2004 6:06 PM

Quote:
MikeV - 10/27/2004 7:47 PM

Rudy!

He's the man. Look for him in '08.

He's liberal on certain social issues, stem cell research, etc. and a hawk on terrorism.

Bush will win this election, if he doesn't and Kerry wins I think the next large attack on the US will push the electorate far to the right for years.

What's this obsession for Obama, he gives one speech and you guys are in love?
Let me get this straight - we suffer the largest terrorist attack in history while Republicans are in office, but an attack will only occur if a Democrat is elected? How does that make any sense at all?
I think you oversimplify things. Bush was in office 8 months when 9-11 happen. From the posts I've read of yours you're either unwilling or unable to look at things objectively and without your bias. I'm biased, but I often times can and do put those biases aside for the sake of arguement. Okay, back to my argument, most people realize that Clinton did nothing for 8 years in the face of terrorism, the first WTC, Embassy bombings, Somolia (not terrorism, but against Islamo-crazies) USS Cole, etc. So the fact that 9-11 happen on Bush's watch meant little in the eyes of "most" Americans. Even today in the latest polls, over 60% (and even up to 70% in some polls) of Americans feel that Bush will keep America safer than would John Kerry. Hell, even Putin said last week that "Terrorism will get stronger if Bush is not relected." I know that you don't see this, but this is what "most" people believe, by the numbers I just meanted that even about 20% of Kerry voters believe this to be true as well.

On a slightly related subject, check out this article written by Col. David Hackworth in 2000. Hackworth is a retired, but now a talking head on a number of Cable shows. Aside from the Nostradomus type feel, the response of the nation, after Gore and the first hypothetical would be the response if Kerry were to win and we were to have another large attack during his term.
http://www.maximonline.com/grit/arti...icle_5479.html
Here's an interesting little tidbit for you. Funny how you're willing to let a tiny little terrorist attack that happened 8 months into Bush's presidency, and one month after he was specifically warned about an impending attack, slide by YET in your litany of things that Clinton did wrong you list the first WTC bombing which happened 46 DAYS! into Clinton's first term. Guess who was pres. before Clinton? By your rationale Shrub Sr. is at fault for that one at least. Rebuttal?
LK ONE is offline  
post #40 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-28-2004, 08:28 PM Thread Starter
BenzWorld Senior Member
 
Jamison's Avatar
 
Date registered: Dec 2003
Vehicle: 98 BMW 528i
Location: Pennsylvania - Lehigh valley
Posts: 589
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Send a message via AIM to Jamison
(Thread Starter)
RE: If anyone could be president who would it be?

clinton didnt do anything about it....duh
Jamison is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Mercedes-Benz Forum > General Mercedes-Benz Forums > Off-Topic

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Mercedes-Benz Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











  • Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
     
    Thread Tools
    Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
    Email this Page Email this Page
    Display Modes
    Linear Mode Linear Mode



    Posting Rules  
    You may post new threads
    You may post replies
    You may not post attachments
    You may not edit your posts

    BB code is On
    Smilies are On
    [IMG] code is On
    HTML code is Off
    Trackbacks are On
    Pingbacks are On
    Refbacks are On

     

    Title goes here

    close
    video goes here
    description goes here. Read Full Story
    For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome