Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-14-2004, 11:55 PM Thread Starter
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Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

Lesbian Daughter Remark Controversy.

This little controversy seems to expose a major double standard. Kerry is being critisized and the rightwing is trying to create a scandal over one or two innocous remarks Kerry made referring to the Cheney's lesbian daughter (now there's a girl that's got a hell of a Prozac bill).

IMHO,Kerry seems to be justified by the same argument the right used to justify making fair game out of Kerry's combat service - that he was the one that brought it up. Kerry simply was making a comment on something that had already been brought out in the open by Cheney himself, when his daughter was present, no less. Personally, I think Lynne Cheney's reaction made it look like she is on some kind of shame trip about her daughter. Perhaps she should seek counseling.

But I degress. A little history is in order.

Cheney first brings it up (he also mentioned it in number of speeches afterwards):

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20040825/a_cheney25.art.htm

Excerpt:

Vice President Cheney broke with President Bush on Tuesday on the question of same-sex marriage, saying he believes the issue should be left to the states. “Freedom means freedom for everyone,� he said at a campaign rally in Davenport, Iowa.

“Lynne and I have a gay daughter, so it's an issue our family is very familiar with,� Cheney said as his daughter Mary stood in the audience. He said he opposes the constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage that Bush has endorsed.

“But the president makes basic policy for the administration,� he added.

Cheney's comments were remarkable on several fronts. He acknowledged his daughter's homosexuality in a more direct way than ever before. While he said in the vice presidential debate in 2000 that the issue of gay marriage should be left to the states, he had not publicly reiterated that view since Bush's decision in February to embrace a federal constitutional ban.


He comments on it again in the debates:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6173358/

"Cheney was then asked about a sensitive issue for him personally, a proposed constitutional amendment, backed by Bush, to outlaw same-sex marriage.

Cheney, whose daughter Mary is a lesbian, said he believed “it’s really no one’s business� what relations people enter into. Cheney acknowledged that he and Bush did not see eye-to-eye on same-sex relationships but said, “He sets policy for this administration, and I support the president.�

Edwards complimented Cheney for standing by his daughter and said he and Kerry agreed that marriage was between a man and a woman. But he said the difficulties gay couples faced had been politicized and that same-sex couples should be allowed to enjoy government and employment benefits like married couples."



Like I said, there appears to be a double standard here. Many people felt that attacking a combat soldier's war service was unseemly and out-of-bounds, and the right justified it by saying Kerry put it in play. How is this situation with Cheney's daughter any different ? By the rightwings own past justifications for its Swift Boat smears, the dems could have run televison ads about her gayness. This act by Kerry seems to be justified by the right's own actions. Are any of you ready to admit a double standard ?

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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 12:21 AM
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

i really don't see a big deal about Kerry's statements and was rather appauled by Mrs. cheney's responce. wtf? how freaking rude of her. i agree kv, she sounded like a woman with some guilt.



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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 01:06 AM
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

This thing with Mary has been going on for at least a year in the gay press, activists trying to lay some sort of guilt trip on Mary for not coming forward and working against the Bush/Cheney re-election campaign because of GWB's extremeism (all kinda isms) about same-sex marriage.

check this out:



http://advocate.com/html/stories/925/925_debate.asp
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 04:59 AM
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

I remember a long time ago when Bill Clinton was playing on his brothers drug problem and all hell broke loose when someone mentioned it.

If you want to talk about your own children that's fine but that doesn't make it fair game for everyone.

One thing that I've learned about people is the ones that cheap shot other families usually have a unbalanced family themselves.

I'm sure John F is upset about not getting a chunk of the
Forbes fortune.

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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 06:26 AM
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

I thought the exchange between Cheney and Edwards was about right, concerning the whole stupid non-issue. Kerry didn't do it with the grace and sincerity that Edwards successfully affected. In fact, Kerry's looked calculated and contrived. It allows us to ask, "Is the Cheney daughter the only person that Kerry-Edwards knows who is gay?" Bringing the daughter in once and doing it gracefully is okay. Bringing the daughter in twice and clumsily the second time opened the door for the criticism.

Was it fair criticism? Heck no it wasn't fair. Neither is the majority of unkind things that the Dems have said contra-Bushie or contra-Cheney. Fairness has very little to do with politics. Its all about manipulating perceptions so you can get your side your swallow your arguments, raw and unexamined while rejecting your opponents' argument as being totally unwholesome.

What surprises me is how many folks enshroud themselves with one side or the other as though it were some sort of Cosmic Revealed Truth. Uh...its politics folks. When its done, go fishing.

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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 08:14 AM
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

I thought it was a tactical error for Kerry to bring her up. It didn't add anything to his answer.
On the other hand, the whole response to the question seemed shallow. The question itself plays into the view that as long as being gay is a choice, it is ok to deny gay people some civil rights. Given the wide range of human sexual inclinations and our tendency to experiment, some degree of sexual behavior must be chosen.
Since Bush was not going to follow the views of the religious right on national television, they were going to sound very similar in their answers. More subtly on Kerry's part would have put him ahead.
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 09:43 AM
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

Quote:
Botnst - 10/15/2004 8:26 AM

...What surprises me is how many folks enshroud themselves with one side or the other as though it were some sort of Cosmic Revealed Truth. Uh...its politics folks. When its done, go fishing.
I agree, it's getting waaay to emotional now. It bothers me that people can be so divisive, but that's politics in our country and in pretty much every other country. I just hope that once the election's over, we can work together a little better. We'll see...

But what makes one person so tied to one candidate and against another can be different, based on your belief system.

For me, it's almost a moral battle. The next president will likely have four Supreme Court nominations in the next few years. These nominations will shape the judicial outlook of our country for many years to come. If it's Bush, we will hopefully have pro-life judges, or at least conservative ones like Clarence Thomas.

If it's Kerry.... God help us.

That's what gets me fired up about this election.

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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 07:57 PM
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

God,God,God! Is that you Jerry? Does anyone else here realize how much Falls Church, VA. (home of that fat buffoon Falwell)sounds like False Church? Perhaps the devil is having a big laugh on us with his little troll Jerry?
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 08:05 PM
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

KV, you're gonna make me vomit with all these stories. First, O'Reilly, and now, Cheney's daughter... that's just "nassy", not nasty, but "nassy"... The last things on my mind are Cheney's daughter, and O'Reilly, especially when the word sex is involved.

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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 10-15-2004, 08:08 PM Thread Starter
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RE: Steamy sex scandal #2, Cheney's Daugher

The next thread is going to be about O'reilly having an affair with Cheney's daughter.

Personally, I think this gives a boost to the genetic theory of homosexuality - ever notice how "butch" Lynne Cheney is?


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