Support our troops: Marines tell the real story of Iraq War. Here's a hint - sounds like "NAM" - Page 3 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #21 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-11-2004, 11:25 AM
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Lest we forget the thirty years of political records in the time between Vietnam and Iraq.

John Kerry`s Iraq Quandary
Posted 10/11/2004
By Michael Ashbury

On September 6, 2002, John Kerry in an op-ed in The New York Times stated that “I refuse ever to accept the notion that anything I`ve suggested with respect to Iraq was nuanced. It was clear. It was precise. It was, in fact, prescient. It was ahead of the curve about what the difficulties were. And that is precisely what a president is supposed to be. I think I was right, 100% correct, about how you should have done Iraq.�

A sampling of his prescient remarks:

1990 “Iraq has developed a chemical weapons capability, and is pursuing a nuclear weapons development program.� (In 1991 Senator Kerry was in the minority of senators who voted against the Persian Gulf War.)

1997 “Should the resolve of our allies wane, the United States must not lose its resolve to take action.� He further warned that if Saddam Hussein were not held to account for violation of UN resolutions, some future conflict would have “greater consequence.�

1998 “I think there is a disconnect between the depth of the threat that Saddam Hussein presents to the world and what we are at the moment talking about doing ... we have to be prepared to go the full distance, which is to do everything possible to disrupt his regime and to encourage the forces of democracy....

“I am way ahead of the commander in chief, and I’m probably way ahead of my colleagues and certainly of much of the country. But I believe this. I believe that he has used these weapons before. He has invaded another country. He views himself as a modern-day Nebuchadnezzar. He wants to continue to play the uniting critical role in that part of the world. And I think we have to stand up to that.�

2002 “I would disagree with John McCain that it’s the actual weapons of mass destruction he may use against us, it’s what he may do in another invasion of Kuwait or in a miscalculation about the Kurds or a miscalculation about Iran or particularly Israel.

“Those are the things that — that I think present the greatest danger. He may even miscalculate and slide these weapons off to terrorist groups to invite them to be a surrogate to use them against the United States. It’s the miscalculation that poses the greatest threat.�

2003 “If Saddam Hussein is unwilling to bend to the international community`s already existing order, then he will have invited enforcement, even if that enforcement is mostly at the hands of the United States, a right we retain even if the Security Council fails to act.�

2004 (January) “Saddam Hussein took us to war once before. In that war, young Americans were killed. He went to war in order to take over the oil fields. It wasn`t just an invasion of Kuwait. He was heading for the oil fields of Saudi Arabia. And that would have had a profound effect on the security of the United States.

“This is a man who has used weapons of mass destruction, unlike other people on this Earth today, not only against other people but against his own people. This is a man who tried to assassinate a former president of the United States, a man who lobbed 36 missiles into Israel in order to destabilize the Middle East, a man who is so capable of miscalculation that he even brought this war on himself.

“This is a man who, if he was left uncaptured, would have continued to be able to organize the Ba`athists. He would have continued to terrorize the people, just in their minds, because of 30 years of terror in Iraq.�

2004 (September) “Let me be as blunt and direct with the American people as I can be. The invasion of Iraq was a profound diversion from the battle against our greatest enemy — al Qaeda.... The president`s misjudgment, miscalculation and mismanagement of the war in Iraq all made the war on terror harder to win.�

Are these the comments of a candidate for president who says he was prescient, ahead of the curve about the difficulties, 100 percent correct, or are these the comments of an opportunist who will do and say anything to sway public opinion?

Michael Ashbury, a noted researcher, is the author of ``Who is the REAL John Kerry?`` ( 2004). His website is at Michael receives e-mail at
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post #22 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-11-2004, 02:05 PM Thread Starter
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RE: Support our troops: Marines tell the real story of Iraq War. Here's a hint - sounds like "NAM"

Just not buying it, Bot. Kerry would not have rushed to war. All the mismanagement in this came from Bush. Trying to lay some of the blame off on Kerry is ludicrous.
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post #23 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-11-2004, 02:12 PM
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RE: Support our troops: Marines tell the real story of Iraq War. Here's a hint - sounds like "NAM"

Botnst - 10/11/2004 11:28 AM

Some more of that objective analysis, I see.
Some more of that objective analysis, I see.

"If spending money you don't have is the height of stupidity, borrowing money to give it away is the height of insanity." -- anon
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post #24 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-12-2004, 05:54 AM
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RE: Support our troops: Marines tell the real story of Iraq War. Here's a hint - sounds like "NAM"

jamminjames - 10/10/2004 9:17 PM

Since this board has turned into a Liberal hate-fest I'll be brief...

I have a son in Korea (soon to go to Afghanistan) - Army. His wife is in Baghdad - Army. My other son is in-country Iraq but is unable give his location - Marines. I communicate with them at least 2-3 per week... So I have an idea of what's going on.

First - If you think about it, when someone says that our soldiers, who volunteered, are dying for nothing - how do you think that makes me feel? How do you think it makes them feel? The ironic thing is that our enemy wants us to say that; it demoralizes our troops and divides a nation. What better time to attack when moral is down and we're bickering amongst ourselves...

Second - It's almost a joke over there of how the Liberal media is portraying what's really going on. If you believe everything the media says... Then you're not an informed voter.

Third - For everyone you show me that says your opinion I can show you the same for mine. Again, the media loves one particular side.

I'm sure I'll catch a lot of flack over this and quite frankly I could care less. Did I want my kids to go? No. Am I proud of them for what they’re doing? Absolutely! Life is not absolute. Have you even considered that a possibility exist that because of our involvement we have prevented a future calamity? You can not tell me that you can see into the future and tell me that our involvement did absolutely nothing to protect our Homeland. Try wrapping your brain around that one.

Whether you believe in what we're doing or not, show our troops that you are behind them - otherwise you might as well hand our enemy his gun...
I remember when the anti-Vietnam crowd started-up. First they attacked the policy--carefully saying it wasn't the soldier's fault as they were following orders.

Then folks realized that following unlawful orders was illegal so they started claiming that the adventure was illegal and therefore, ordering soldiers to Vietnam was illegal. This is the time when I volunteered for military service.

Then they realized that if people went anyway, then they were as contemptible as the politicians who sent them. This is when the anti-war fanatics started abusing soldiers.

I think right now we are somewhere between the first and second paragraph. I figure we're about a year away from the transition from the second to third paragraph.
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post #25 of 25 (permalink) Old 10-12-2004, 07:42 AM
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RE: Support our troops: Marines tell the real story of Iraq War. Here's a hint - sounds like "NAM"

I cannot believe any of these parallels to the Vietnam war ignore the absolutely clear conclusion that the war in Vietnam was a meaningless waste of American and Vietnamese lives. Once you acknowledge that fact, the role of war protesters is easier to judge realistically.

That the troops suffered upon their return is a shameful chapter of our history as well, which could have been avoided if the gutless turds in political office then, as now, were able to admit the whole sordid experience was a horrible mistake of judgement. But quit blindly bitching about war protesters. Many of the younger generation that exists today is alive because the war ended when it did. Our government would have been content to continue killing without any chance of winning this war nearly endlessly.

Be grateful to those who risked much to force the politicians to alter their policy of killing people for reasons that made no sense. Quit bitching about the fact that it took millions American citizens to exercise their rights and protest the war to make continuing the killing of American boys and Vietnamese people an politically unsupportable position. Ending the war in Vietnam enabled much of the advanced weapons development that led to the end of the cold war. None of this would have been affordable if Vietnam had continued without end for another 15 or more years.

The war was without meaning, but that does not mean the soldiers we sent there deserved to be mistreated upon their return. The fact they were mistreated, however, does not mean the war was any more meaningful. Two wrongs do not make a right. Jim
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