Will bargain gas harm your car? - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #11 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-15-2008, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by CalifSLK View Post
I totally agree with you even that I use Shell almost exclusively. But the brand dedicated additives are put in at the time they fill the tanker truck.
You mean ARCO is putting-in Shell and Chevron additives, or Shell and Chevron drivers are fooling around open gas tanks at the ARCO refinery?
Have hard time to believe any of those.
Once again -our ML320 in almost 10 years.90 kmiles have never seen any fuel additives (unless added by bargain station) and still runs perfect on everything original, but MAF sensor and plugs.
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post #12 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-15-2008, 04:51 PM
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If they advertise having additive, they wouldn't pass ISO9000 audit anyway. So I believe no large corporation would risk that.

Since we don't use our SLK everyday, it has a bad habit of forming carbon deposits on the piston tops that cause pinging. The remedy is adding Chevron additive and run at high RPM for 20-30 miles. So we keep Chevron additive around. So I know that they do work.
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post #13 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-15-2008, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kajtek1 View Post
You mean ARCO is putting-in Shell and Chevron additives, or Shell and Chevron drivers are fooling around open gas tanks at the ARCO refinery?
Have hard time to believe any of those.
Start with the crude. Refineries, regardless of who owns them, produce a product generally called "base fuel" at the rated octane. This is typically what is considered "cheap gas" or the no-name stuff that ends up at convenience stores, discount clubs and the like.

That same "base fuel" then gets Chevron, Shell, BP or other companie's proprietary cocktail of detergents . . . and then you have branded fuel. Otherwise, each gas company would have to have multiple refineries around teh country, which they dont.
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post #14 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-15-2008, 09:13 PM
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Cool 'Trust Me' it's all the same

Anybody in California knows what the term trust me means!!!

GI Joes gas station buys it's gas from the same vendor, then because it has alcohol in it joe can add a few hundred gallons of WATER to the tank and American cars will burn it.

However, mb cars will sputter and miss and die until you run enough sea-foam to get the water out of you fuel rail. Remember, mb cars are (now) single rail fueled and do not circulate fuel. That water joe put in will cause you alot of problems.

OBTW Sea-Foam costs 6+ us a can.

Stay with Premium, name brand fuels.

Experience, not trust.

B

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post #15 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-16-2008, 11:04 AM Thread Starter
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My friend has his MB for roughly 10 yrs, and he uses only ARCO and sometime Costco gas. The highest grade is 91 octanes in AZ. These two places tend to cost less than any other stations. He uses the $4 fuel cleaner from Checkers 2-3 times a year. He never has any problem with his MB.

I used to own the Si and Lexus with premium fuel. I pumped at ARCO and Costco too. I uses the $4 fuel cleaner too. It is a fraction of the cost of Chevron, which is pre-mixed. I never have any problem with my previous vehicles. So far, I get the 91 octanes gas at Costco for the MB, and it is running great.

If you feel better with your choice of gas station, please continue to pump there. We do not have any problem with that!
Quote:
Originally Posted by MRBSMITH View Post
Anybody in California knows what the term trust me means!!!

GI Joes gas station buys it's gas from the same vendor, then because it has alcohol in it joe can add a few hundred gallons of WATER to the tank and American cars will burn it.

However, mb cars will sputter and miss and die until you run enough sea-foam to get the water out of you fuel rail. Remember, mb cars are (now) single rail fueled and do not circulate fuel. That water joe put in will cause you alot of problems.

OBTW Sea-Foam costs 6+ us a can.

Stay with Premium, name brand fuels.

Experience, not trust.

B

Enjoy it while you can!
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post #16 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-16-2008, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by MRBSMITH View Post
GI Joes gas station buys it's gas from the same vendor, then because it has alcohol in it joe can add a few hundred gallons of WATER to the tank and American cars will burn it.
There's nothing to stop an independent owner of an Arco, Chevron, BP, Exxon, etc station from doing the same thing as GI Joe's . . . and still charge a premium price for it.
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post #17 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-16-2008, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by New04quest View Post
My friend has his MB for roughly 10 yrs, and he uses only ARCO and sometime Costco gas. The highest grade is 91 octanes in AZ. These two places tend to cost less than any other stations. He uses the $4 fuel cleaner from Checkers 2-3 times a year. He never has any problem with his MB.

I used to own the Si and Lexus with premium fuel. I pumped at ARCO and Costco too. I uses the $4 fuel cleaner too. It is a fraction of the cost of Chevron, which is pre-mixed. I never have any problem with my previous vehicles. So far, I get the 91 octanes gas at Costco for the MB, and it is running great.

If you feel better with your choice of gas station, please continue to pump there. We do not have any problem with that!
One of the reasons you only have 91 Octane is that you are above 1000 feet in Gilbert. Gas Companies factor in altitude in their supply chain.

You say you have "never had any problems" using costco or ARCO. As long as you are using the correct octane and are using those additives that you say you are using a few times a year you won't see any short term problems. The longer term issues are things like shorter life of the plugs, MAF replacement at under 120K miles, and a high potential for more fuel filters and wear and tear on the fuel pumps and injector system. Things that normally might still be going strong at 150000 miles might start failing at only 90-100,000.

That is the main place where you see the difference in fuel quality. It is subtle and insidious but it is there. Top Tier makes of gas are certified by Benz and BMW for a reason.

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post #18 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-16-2008, 06:36 PM
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Curious . . . how would a MAF fail because of fuel quality? Perhaps from the dirty air around cheap gas stations?

In addition to altitude, temperature and humidity also have an effect on how an engine responds to a certain octane. For instance, in the dry high temp desert, a higher octane is needed to prevent predetonation, particularly in cars without knock sensors.
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post #19 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-16-2008, 08:55 PM Thread Starter
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How do you know all these things? How do you know GI Joe gas is not from the same fineries as these so calls top tiers? How do you know these so calls top tiers do not do the same thing as so call bad GI Joe station? All the stations are certified and licensed to operate their station, and they are supposed to abide by the law. If these idiots or private owners decide to cheat the system, they will find way to do it. There was a Chevron in my previous city closed down due to bad practices. Regardless of their certification, bad owner still do bad things. How do you know you get what you pay for at these so calls top tier stations?

I have not encountered the symptoms in my vehicles from your list. I replaced the Sequoia spark plug a couple nights ago. It is at 120K miles. There is very little carbon built up on those plugs. I do not have problem with those plugs, but I decided to change it out anyway.

I will continue to use these stations to pump my vehicles. From my owning experiences, I do not encountered problem from these stations. If you are happy with your top tier stations, please continue to pump there and enjoy it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcbear View Post
One of the reasons you only have 91 Octane is that you are above 1000 feet in Gilbert. Gas Companies factor in altitude in their supply chain.

You say you have "never had any problems" using costco or ARCO. As long as you are using the correct octane and are using those additives that you say you are using a few times a year you won't see any short term problems. The longer term issues are things like shorter life of the plugs, MAF replacement at under 120K miles, and a high potential for more fuel filters and wear and tear on the fuel pumps and injector system. Things that normally might still be going strong at 150000 miles might start failing at only 90-100,000.

That is the main place where you see the difference in fuel quality. It is subtle and insidious but it is there. Top Tier makes of gas are certified by Benz and BMW for a reason.

Enjoy it while you can!
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post #20 of 52 (permalink) Old 01-16-2008, 11:59 PM
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Once again I repeat that from my experience spending money on extra additives is a waste. As already mentioned:
-all base gasoline comes from one refinery in the area regardless the brand it is sold under
- supposable the high end gas has more additives in it, but nobody can tell when and where the Chevron additives are added between the pickup at ARCO refinery and the gas station
-last generation base gasoline has some detergents and other additives in it. Question do you need more?
-beside the MB that is reaching 100k running solely on the cheapest Premium gas with no extra additives ever, we drove Volvo on the cheapest regular. The engine never gave us any problem besides aging seals, always passed smog with flying colors and was junked with engine running perfectly at 172,000 miles. That was 4-cylinder in quite heavy sedan, where gas pedal had usually only 2 positions.

Last edited by Kajtek1; 01-17-2008 at 12:03 AM.
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