Similarities between gas and diesel? - Page 2 - Mercedes-Benz Forum

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post #11 of 16 (permalink) Old 10-11-2006, 09:45 PM
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DU MK,

The modern diesel is not nearly as polluting as you state....maybe an old Oldmobile conventionally aspirated POS.

Also 15% better fuel economy is not realistic.....the diesel is much more efficient.

Please read.

http://www.sae.org/automag/techbriefs_01-00/08.htm

Michael
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post #12 of 16 (permalink) Old 10-11-2006, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vodica
One more small thing:

Diesel Economy
Mythical Fuel Savings
The decision to purchase a diesel W210 should not be made on the basis of fuel savings. The turbodiesels are about $5,000 more expensive used than comparable E320s. To come out ahead financially, you’d first have to recoup through fuel savings your initial $5,000 outlay. The numbers just don’t work out under any reasonable scenario. Let’s make some assumptions:
• You’d get 28 MPG on the highway with an E320 gas.
• You’d get 35 MPG with an E300 diesel.
• You pay $3.15 for a gallon for premium unleaded gasoline.
• You pay $2.90 for a gallon for diesel. (Diesel is actually more expensive than premium gas in some parts of the country.)
Under these assumptions, gas for the E320 would cost $0.11 per mile and diesel for the E300 would cost $0.08 per mile. The diesel would reduce your fuel costs by about 3 cents per mile. To simply break even after paying the $5,000 premium for the diesel engine, you’d need to drive the car about 150,000 miles. Assuming you drive 10,000 miles per year, that would take 15 years!

My 2 cents: Here in NC you need to pay 25 cents more for diesel, so for me will be more like 30 YEARS of driving just to offset price difference.
I will stick with my E320.
I didn't know you had W210 diesels in the US to compare to. Anyway, if a used diesel car is more expensive to buy compared to a similar gas car, it may indicate some positive features/issues of the diesel car. The point is that for MB, many of the diesel cars are equal in price with a comparable gas car, if not less expensive.

Take an example, the current W211 E320 CDI would cost 47.502 euros in Germany while the E350 would cost 47.908 euros. Both do 250 km/h, the CDI accelerates from 0 to 100 km/h in 6.8 s while the E350 needs 6.9 s. CO2 figures are 194-202 for the CDI, 231-244 for E350 (it does not matter if a gallon of diesel produces more CO2 if you spend less, of course you can go from a Hummer to a Smart too but the above comparison is quite fair as far as I can see, if I only consider figures that are easy to get and compare, not particles etc.). It could well be that the CDI is a lot more expensive when the cars have been used for a few years but that should not be considered a disadvantage of diesel technology as such.

If you compare the S320cdi with the S350, you would notice a big cost advantage for the diesel (for a new car).

My two Euro cents are: take the time, test drive the cars and consider the choice carefully for your local conditions.
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post #13 of 16 (permalink) Old 10-11-2006, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by my90300E
I had anticipated such remarks from the hearing impared.

While MSI does REDUCE detonation into smaller increments diesels will always be louder due to the characteristic of them....DETONATION.

Thank you for your welcome into this century, I offer you a ride on my buckboard

Michael
You must be the guy I have seen driving with stethoscope on his head and listening to the engine?
So coming to the real World, what can be a difference between hearing nothing and ...... hearing nothing?
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post #14 of 16 (permalink) Old 10-11-2006, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vodica
One more small thing:

Diesel Economy
Mythical Fuel Savings
The decision to purchase a diesel W210 should not be made on the basis of fuel savings. The turbodiesels are about $5,000 more expensive used than comparable E320s. To come out ahead financially, you’d first have to recoup through fuel savings your initial $5,000 outlay. The numbers just don’t work out under any reasonable scenario. Let’s make some assumptions:
• You’d get 28 MPG on the highway with an E320 gas.
• You’d get 35 MPG with an E300 diesel.
• You pay $3.15 for a gallon for premium unleaded gasoline.
• You pay $2.90 for a gallon for diesel. (Diesel is actually more expensive than premium gas in some parts of the country.).
You can buy 97 E320 diesel in the range of 10 grands. Even with 200k, those engines have at least 300 k of life in them.
Gas mileage myths? I drive "normally"(fast for US standards, slow for Europeans standards).
So keeping in the 80-90 mph range my E320 wagon averages 23 mpg, 93' E300D with 2.5l averaged 28 mpg, VW Jetta wagon tdi 32 mpg.
Personally I love the space and versatility of E320 wagon.
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post #15 of 16 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 07:27 AM
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I have limited knowledge of MB models but have been told that the last deisel wagon made was the '87 300TD. Is your E320 deisel wagon of more recent vintage?
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post #16 of 16 (permalink) Old 10-12-2006, 09:08 AM
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My present 99 wagon is gasser, yet it is getting better mileage than 83 diesel wagon I used to have.
Mercedes made big progress in last decade to lower fuel consumption. I hear new 320 cdi can exceed 40 mpg.
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